The MM Network

[WRXtranceformed]

Or you can go into sales engineering 

or you could just go slam your dick in a door, repeatedly.

Money buys a lot of trips to the ER to fix a bruised dick. Or some skank hussies to ice it down for you

[V1GiLaNtE]

Learn something new? The horror!

Taylor - I moved to be a PM about two years ago. I don't know of anything for what's basically entry level, but I can tell you a PM with coding experience is highly sought after and hired as TPMs. At Amazon, they're in the same job family as engineers. Consider going down that path since you already seem to have a knack for coding.

Technical PMs are a great career path,  but one year as a tester doesn't make you a technical PM.  
From a demand and compensation perspective, it would be much wiser long term to stay an engineer for at least 5 years, learn the ins and outs of delivering software,  then make the jump to project management.  
I know a few people who have done that (usually after 8-10 years though) and are very good PMs, and are paid as well or better than engineers.  (though with that comes othe rthings like proposals, etc)

Of course, your personal goals may vary and I think ultimately thats the moral of the story here.   Money isnt everything.

Personally Im in the reverse situation.  I manage 50 engineers and 12 projects,  and Im trying to take a step back from that so I can do some coding again.

This is where I'm at. Functional analyst (requirements, solutioning, use cases, blah blah). I keep getting pushed into a PM role and I'm trying my best to get back to a more functional role. I don't really enjoy status, risks, bs.

[Deceus]

I would kill for a junior PM role or some kinda decent scrum master position over taking a senior java web developer position like I feel I'm about to be forced into. But I definitely agree with Evan's input here. If you're looking to jump ship quickly and get paid well, a junior/mid level developer position is the way to go for sure. It should definitely be something you're looking for on the side in case nothing solid pops up for what you really want.

Seriously my 3 junior/mid searches were basically less than 48 hours and came with some serious bumps in pay with some very low initial expectations.

[.RJ]

This is where I'm at. Functional analyst (requirements, solutioning, use cases, blah blah). I keep getting pushed into a PM role and I'm trying my best to get back to a more functional role. I don't really enjoy status, risks, bs.

Product Management > Project Management

[V1GiLaNtE]

This is where I'm at. Functional analyst (requirements, solutioning, use cases, blah blah). I keep getting pushed into a PM role and I'm trying my best to get back to a more functional role. I don't really enjoy status, risks, bs.

Product Management > Project Management

#preach

[Senor_Taylor]

I don't want to do development. Never wanted to be a developer. Never want to be a developer. There's no way I can or want to be an engineer for 4 more years. I want to be a PM.

Yes, I know the salary ceiling is lower. I don't care. I went to school to be a PM or consultant. Me being in an engineering role now was my way to getting exposed first hand to lots of technologies. Yes, I'm skilled in programming and can do it. Do I like to do it? Some times, but not most times. I enjoy writing SQL more than I do using any real language.

[Jake]

This is where I'm at. Functional analyst (requirements, solutioning, use cases, blah blah). I keep getting pushed into a PM role and I'm trying my best to get back to a more functional role. I don't really enjoy status, risks, bs.

Product Management > Project Management

Yes, so much. I got into product management in 2014 and really, really enjoy it.

[Evan]

Or you can go into sales engineering and make more money than your current boss's boss

If you're going to make shit up,  then might as well say be a used car salesman and retire on a yacht.

[WRXtranceformed]

Show me where on the doll the salesmen hurt you

[rherold9]

The bickering between you two reminds me of a married couple. Thank you for the laughs recently in multiple threads from multiple people. Please keep the recent turmoil on the forums going; it's v entertaining

[Apoc]

This is where I'm at. Functional analyst (requirements, solutioning, use cases, blah blah). I keep getting pushed into a PM role and I'm trying my best to get back to a more functional role. I don't really enjoy status, risks, bs.

Product Management > Project Management

Yeah, project management is pretty terrible but it's a good way to get started and learn the ins/outs of stakeholder and resource management. I'd say the same about being a functional analyst - I've done it off and on over the years and it's helped me understand how to think like my customers. I did product management as I was transitioning out of analytics and liked it, but personally wanted a broader scope. My role is managing an actual program (read: service offering), so there's no project management as it's typically defined in the industry. I like it and can recommend that as a career goal if folks can swing it.

[.RJ]

Show me where on the doll the salesmen hurt you

Ok, I lol'd

[Deceus]

Speaking of Program Managers, I have to explain to mine tomorrow why it's utterly retarded to have me set my own delivery dates. Apparently our idiot of a tech lead is spearheading this and he doesn't know any better to stop her. We were updating this giant spreadsheet with work estimates all week and I was thinking "cool they're going to take this information, do their job and dictate the schedule to the customer based off it". Nope, we're just taking our estimates adding a day and tacking on things to the end as they come up with no regards to any kind of priority. "What's that? A critical issue with a year end report you need done next week? Sorry best I can do is next month." Until now the customer has been handing us tickets with due dates assigned with no regards to development time which is equally retarded but now my ass is on the line when the train-wreck happens.

I mean seriously just today: they put me on a new contract I had no idea was actually going to happen, to work tickets I've never seen before and just threw out 2 days worth of work estimates for 8 maintenance tickets. This same day they're defending this plan and are utterly confused to why some of us are telling them it's a bad idea for us to plan out our next 3 months and make promises to the customer when we have 0 exposure to the "big picture" since we work for a living instead of sit in meetings with government all day.

At least the PM is conceding some good points have been made but the tech lead just seems to be doubling down so it should be a fun morning tomorrow.

I honestly can't leave this place fast enough. On my second round of phone interviews with Willowtree but I fear this is where I'm going to lose them since they want to spend an hour digging into my background and do a "code share". I've learned my lesson about building proprietary software, never again. I asked for some specifics about what they'd like to talk about since my current background is pretty simplistic and mostly centered around complex business logic. They basically just said APIs, Constant Integration and "brush up" on Java given that's all I use at my current position. Given how super vague all that is should be a fun conversation...

[Eco_Boi_Stephen]

Does anyone know of any Alumn currently working in law? I'm a Global Justice Studies and Arabic major looking to go to law school after undergrad and I'm currently searching for some internships.

I was just going back through this and must not have hit "Post Reply" before shutting my machine down or something...

I realize you're looking more towards law firm but I'm friends with the ADA here in Frederick County, VA and they do have internships. He's fighting for it to be paid which I guess it hasn't been in the past. It's not a firm but will get you in the building with the Judges.

Let me know if you're be interested and I'll get you guys connected.

That would be great! It is a bit of a hike though [emoji28]

Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk

[Senor_Taylor]

Does anyone know of any Alumn currently working in law? I'm a Global Justice Studies and Arabic major looking to go to law school after undergrad and I'm currently searching for some internships.

I was just going back through this and must not have hit "Post Reply" before shutting my machine down or something...

I realize you're looking more towards law firm but I'm friends with the ADA here in Frederick County, VA and they do have internships. He's fighting for it to be paid which I guess it hasn't been in the past. It's not a firm but will get you in the building with the Judges.

Let me know if you're be interested and I'll get you guys connected.

That would be great! It is a bit of a hike though [emoji28]

Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk

Don't be afraid to travel for opportunities. I wish I was more open to traveling for an internship.

Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk

[Deceus]

On my second round of phone interviews with Willowtree but I fear this is where I'm going to lose them since they want to spend an hour digging into my background and do a "code share". I've learned my lesson about building proprietary software, never again. I asked for some specifics about what they'd like to talk about since my current background is pretty simplistic and mostly centered around complex business logic. They basically just said APIs, Constant Integration and "brush up" on Java given that's all I use at my current position. Given how super vague all that is should be a fun conversation...

Called it ...

The "code share" was sitting me in front of a terminal and asking me to convert an array of numbers into a bar chart. So. Stupid. I took a bad approach at first just to get started and probably rode that a little too long but the interviewer eventually pushed to me to use "another" data structure other than trying to do it with 2 lists. It dawned on me that this was a test to see if you know how hashmaps work and I got the solution pretty quickly after that. Only stumbled once or twice after that trying to format the damn thing on the terminal because I haven't needed to do that since college because I don't sit around drawing ascii dicks in the terminal all day and have to make things that people actually use. I figured it was 50/50 we'd be moving on

The kicker is, I thought this was a code "share". Had I known we were doing trivia I would have brushed up on it but instead I built an API over the weekend after sitting through a crash course and not content with that, I hooked it up to a local database since that's how they usually operate and not on static data the course used to get by. Not content with just that I dug up my app I haven't touched in 4 years that wouldn't even compile targeting the newer SDKs and I rebuilt it in an evening using ContraintLayouts, RecyclerViews and converted it to a one Activity - many fragment architecture google seems to be endorsing as best practice these days. Oh you know just real world things that are actually useful to a company.

I'll stop with the "Dear Diary" BS here but damn do I feel like I'm in a bad place right now. Just feel like I burned through my 2 best options in the only commutable city I have.

[Senor_Taylor]

So you haven't heard from the last interview? Don't count yourself out yet.

Other opportunities may pop up too. The ball is in your court since you have a job and aren't desperate.

Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk

[HAULN-SS]

The kicker is, I thought this was a code "share". Had I known we were doing trivia I would have brushed up on it but instead I built an API over the weekend after sitting through a crash course and not content with that, I hooked it up to a local database since that's how they usually operate and not on static data the course used to get by. Not content with just that I dug up my app I haven't touched in 4 years that wouldn't even compile targeting the newer SDKs and I rebuilt it in an evening using ContraintLayouts, RecyclerViews and converted it to a one Activity - many fragment architecture google seems to be endorsing as best practice these days. Oh you know just real world things that are actually useful to a company.

I hope you told them this. I love hearing people talk about shit they do outside of work because they just like working on software.

[Deceus]

The kicker is, I thought this was a code "share". Had I known we were doing trivia I would have brushed up on it but instead I built an API over the weekend after sitting through a crash course and not content with that, I hooked it up to a local database since that's how they usually operate and not on static data the course used to get by. Not content with just that I dug up my app I haven't touched in 4 years that wouldn't even compile targeting the newer SDKs and I rebuilt it in an evening using ContraintLayouts, RecyclerViews and converted it to a one Activity - many fragment architecture google seems to be endorsing as best practice these days. Oh you know just real world things that are actually useful to a company.

I hope you told them this. I love hearing people talk about shit they do outside of work because they just like working on software.

Yeah we spent 30 minutes of the hour going over a list of questions "he had to ask me" that were rather pointless because all they really did was highlight just how bad the current process is at my current position. One question was about side projects and I slipped in the fact that I was busy rebuilding a car from the ground up over the last few years so the side projects stopped but I had done all that over the weekend to show I was serious about a change of pace and because I missed doing it. Just got a "cool" and he didn't even bother to ask about anything specific.

So you haven't heard from the last interview? Don't count yourself out yet.

Other opportunities may pop up too. The ball is in your court since you have a job and aren't desperate.

Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk

No they sent me a rejection letter first thing this morning.  Trying really hard not to take this personally but this is twice now that I've been rejected before even sitting down with someone. The first position was a pretty bad fit so they get a pass. There was no excuse for this. I just told the dude i was disappointed they made this decision so early in the process and that had I know I was walking into a pop quiz on a data structure I hadn't used in 7 years, I would have been much better prepared. I'm just starting to see a pattern here and it's starting to worry me.

"What's the process for testing at your current position?"
We don't really have one.
"What's the current process for code deployment?"
We push things one class at a time and hope for the best.
"Really?"
Yeah really, I've tried really hard over the last few years to change things but no one with any power to make changes sees any reason to.
"What stack are you using?"
None really, 95% of the work is pure java development to handle the complex buisines..
"PASS"
Wut
"HARD PASS"

[JPolen01]

Did this thread change to "discuss computer-related terminology that only 12 people on this board can understand?" I know we go off topic on almost everything but I am so clearly lost here.