Princess Blanca : The NA6

[Scott]

And all that means to me is it needs a new crank, which is a rebuild or buy a new motor.

Step one, take a deep breath. Step two, read: https://forum.miata.net/vb/showthread.php?t=324904, pay close attention to post #6 and the pictures.

"A damaged keyway on a big nose is not tragic. I drill and pin the lower timing belt cog to the pulley boss as a repair. Note 3 pins sticking out of cog and 3 holes in the pulley boss. I added those"

Step #3, if your shop can't do it, find one that can.

Posted again:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dMhKGb_Duzs

[WRXtranceformed]

Buying cheap, old cars seems like such a great idea. Until you actually do it

If you're thinking about using JB Weld to hold your engine together, it's time to rethink your car priorities imo. Refer to the financial advice thread. Sometimes it's the best idea to cut your losses and invest in something newer and presumably more reliable that will cost you less in the long run.

When my wife and I were dating and up until we got engaged, her family did not have a lot of money and she was driving an old POS Sebring because it was given to her years ago. It was free, but the heater and defroster stopped working, the brakes all around were questionable despite being fairly new, the motors on those were crap / time bombs, among a million other little "quirks" that come with old cheap cars. We weren't even married yet and after dumping a few hundred in repairs into it I took her down to the Hyundai dealer a traded that oil-dripping poop pile in for a new Elantra. If a car becomes a safety or reliability issue and the fixes cost more than the car is worth, it's time to make big boy decisions. I'm going through the same thing right now with her little sister who has been living with us. She was gifted an old Buick, which has needed more than the car itself is worth in repairs since she's had it. And it's leaking black stains all over my driveway just like that old Sebring :?

[*insertusernamehere*]

Buying new car. Fixing Miata. Updates to come when it's all done.

I've been planning on getting an econobox for a while now, I just got distracted for a minute. Even if the Miata goes back together its horrible in every aspect for my 70mile round trip commute, but I also don't want to get rid of it. I was waiting for it to come back from the shop before going off and getting something new but looks like that's being flipped the other way around. It's ok. Panic (more like rage) has ended. There is plan. Yay.

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[*insertusernamehere*]

Oh yeah. I was doing some digging at work yesterday and long story short this is definitely because the timing belt job was done poorly. The belt is already torn up and there's a spot on it where you can see something gouged it. The water pump looks new, vcgs and other gaskets look new, so it wasn't BS it was all actually done. They didn't put the crank pulley on right and/or tightened the tbelt too tight causing too much stress. Oh well.

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[WRXtranceformed]

Oh yeah. I was doing some digging at work yesterday and long story short this is definitely because the timing belt job was done poorly. The belt is already torn up and there's a spot on it where you can see something gouged it. The water pump looks new, vcgs and other gaskets look new, so it wasn't BS it was all actually done. They didn't put the crank pulley on right and/or tightened the tbelt causing too much stress. Oh well.

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Man what a bummer. That is frustrating that you have to deal with the fallout now. Another issue with older cars...unless you have a verifiable ownership and service history (including knowing where the work was done, ie quality vs. speed) the older a car gets the more likely it changed hands to owners who simply don't care to maintain it properly or take the cheapest avenue possible to proper fixes (ie epoxy weld).

When I sold my Jag, I maintained a hard bound binder with:
- Every single Jag service record from the prior owner and from my ownership at the local Jag dealer
- TSB / factory recall paperwork and service history
- Carfax report
- Printed, time stamped digital photos of the damage from the low speed rear-end accident it was in
- Warranty documents and transfer details / paperwork
- Every aftermarket part receipt I had

The new owner brought a mechanic friend to look the car over and he literally had nothing to say. I'm assuming the car has treated him well since he bought it, I haven't heard from him since. But even so as a buyer, that's the situation you want to be in for a pre-owned car purchase...that's WAY more than any dealership ever gives you

[ScottyB]

so sorry to hear about all this dude. old cars can find creative ways to bite you in the butt.

what's a used longnose miata engine cost? they can't be THAT hard to find or costly, can they? aside from the crank pulley i always understood those engines to be tanks.

[ViPER1313]

If you're thinking about using JB Weld to hold your engine together, it's time to rethink your car priorities imo. Refer to the financial advice thread. Sometimes it's the best idea to cut your losses and invest in something newer and presumably more reliable that will cost you less in the long run.

Before dismissing something in a condescending manner as a cheap idea, have some understanding of how a timing belt pulley is held on a motor. After you have done a couple timing belts like I have instead of bribing service managers with sweets (see I can be a condescending asshole too), you realize that the pulley is not held in place by that key, it's held together by the torque of the crank bolt. The key is only there to time the motor. So... if you can get it back together then tighten the bolt, it should be fine.

[WRXtranceformed]

Before dismissing something in a condescending manner as a cheap idea, have some understanding of how a timing chain pulley is held on a motor. After you have done a couple timing belts like I have instead of bribing service managers with sweets (see I can be a condescending asshole too), you realize that the pulley is not held in place by that key, it's held together by the torque of the crank bolt. The key is only there to time the motor. So... if you can get it back together then tighten the bolt, it should be fine.

Man I'm glad you're not my mechanic, and you should be glad I'm not your customer :lol:

<3

[ViPER1313]

I <3 you too Lee

[ViPER1313]

But seriously..... there are 2 ways to go about a situation like this. One is to panic and worry like Lee does (<3) every time something doesn't go right, fret all the small details, spend outrageous amounts of money to make sure it's done "perfect" and "right" by a mechanic, or just abandon the car all together and decide to "make a big boy decision" or some similar nonsense justification to spend money new car.

Or...way #2... you can put on your big boy pants and fix it, cheaply. The worst you are out is some JBWeld and Loctite. Doesn't hold up more than 500 miles? Oh well, you are out $10 and 2 hours of your time. If it lasts 500 or 50k miles, those are (almost) free miles you got out of a trash motor. Lasts longer? Great. There is almost no downside to this approach.

Cars are a hell of a lot less fragile than people give them credit for.

I also find it funny that Lee, the money guru, would recommend buying a newer car (a highly depreciating asset) as a strong financial "big boy" decision. Even the Sebring in his example would have needed $7000 to $8000 in repairs over 5 years time to make *purely financial* sense (based of Edmonds 5 year depreciation estimate of $8,970 for a 2016 Hyundai Elantra). I am assuming the Sebring may have been worth $3500 when it started and would probably be worth $2000 when it theoretically could have been sold. There are a hell of a lot of reasons to buy a newer car - not wanting to repair it, you want to feel safe, you like the newer features, personal enjoyment in general... but financially it is still a bad deal.

[Senor_Taylor]

so sorry to hear about all this dude. old cars can find creative ways to bite you in the butt.

what's a used longnose miata engine cost? they can't be THAT hard to find or costly, can they? aside from the crank pulley i always understood those engines to be tanks.

Just so we're clear. The Short Nose Crank. 90-91 had the issues. Matthews engine is the long nose crank and thus did not have the issue.

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[WRXtranceformed]

I put more in maintenance and repairs into that high mileage Sebring every month than what our amortized Elantra lease payment was every month Adam, with the potential for a catastrophic failure that would have been a lot more :lol: Between the savings in gas, the fact that the money they gave us for the Sebring paid for the first 7 months of a two year lease (we traded it early) and the fact that you can't put a price tag on a car not being a safety liability to your loved ones or leaving them stranded in a dangerous situation, I'd say it's a good "investment". I did not say you're going to make money buying newer cars (and you dont have to buy a brand new one, just but a newer car that isn't a PoS), I'm saying you're investing in your financial stability, safety, reliability and sanity. Imo you shouldn't get complacent driving old, potentially unreliable cars. It could leave you in a really bad situation someday.

Or you know, you can super glue your engine together like Adam suggests and just "see what happens" :lol: Personally, I'd do the smart thing and go with plan A but clearly the old busted POS fetish with some of you guys runs deep as blood

[*insertusernamehere*]

so sorry to hear about all this dude. old cars can find creative ways to bite you in the butt.

what's a used longnose miata engine cost? they can't be THAT hard to find or costly, can they? aside from the crank pulley i always understood those engines to be tanks.

Funny part is this is a long nose too. I can get a motor with like ~100k - 130k miles for $5-800 from work. So not bad actually. I'm gonna go talk to the shop on some options today though.

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[*insertusernamehere*]

Input is greatly appreciated, fam.

I'm moving as quickly as I can, however there is no rush since I have transportation still right now.

I'm getting something along the lines of a fit, Sonic, Elantra GT, Mazda 3 because I want mpgs and I'm fighting the dumb urge to peruse pruises. With anything that gets about ~35-40mpgs thats about ~$90/month in gas savings over the Miata. It also has a roof, AC, Bluetooth, etc etc. you get the idea, it's a complete car. It would be great to compliment the Miata and keep my ass getting to work hassle free. And yes, low hassle is plenty worth the money.

As for the Miata, I haven't commented on it because I don't want to do the jb weld fix. I dislike the fact that it has to be done. It wasn't a slapped together mess and I don't want it to become one now. I want it to be a near perfect car, especially when it comes down to the mechanical stuff, but yet here we are. I'm going to talk to the shop and see if he's ok with using loctite 660 on it... I'll make him ok with using it. If it blows up then it goes to sit in a corner for it's wrong doing and have time out til I get a motor and swap it. If it works, then it works. I'd like to keep the Miata, it's fun and for the most part reliable compared to all it's fun car alternatives.

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[ViPER1313]

I still can't stress enough that it's not a bandaid Lee, it's an accepted repair method. It's not shady, really. The JB just has to be strong enough to allow you to tighten the crank bolt 1x without the crank slipping out of time with the gear / and keeping the gear in place until the bolt is tight. The..... key.... is.... for..... assembly..... only. The crank bolt stops the gear from rotating. Once the bolt is tight, the JB can break apart or go away all together and it would still be fine

[ViPER1313]

Or just spot weld the key in place.....

[Senor_Taylor]

I still can't stress enough that it's not a bandaid Lee, it's an accepted repair method. It's not shady, really. The JB just has to be strong enough to allow you to tighten the crank bolt 1x without the crank slipping out of time with the gear / and keeping the gear in place until the bolt is tight. The..... key.... is.... for..... assembly..... only. The crank bolt stops the gear from rotating. Once the bolt is tight, the JB can break apart or go away all together and it would still be fine

This really should be the end of the discussion. The ONLY thing that should be worried about is on resale of the car. If you're not open and forthcoming with this, that's some bad mojo. Hell, even if somehow the engine lost timing, it's not interference and can retimed very easily. I know this because I've done it multiple times.

[*insertusernamehere*]

Told the shop to do the thing. Said he was gonna look at it again and let me know what he thinks. Never called back, drove by the shop and saw the hood up. So hopefully I'll have it back by the end of the week. Probably gonna put it up for sale the moment I get it back. Anyone want a miata?

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[*insertusernamehere*]

Stopped by the shop to see what's what. Shop doesn't want to do the jb weld. He thinks the space where the keyway should be is too messed up to securely do it. So my only option would be to do it myself. I just don't know whether or not he's saying is absolutely right or he just doesn't want to roll that out that kind of work out of the shop. Then, if I do it, am I going to do it right? Decisions decisions. Probably going to do it myself because my only other option would be to have the shop replace the motor or the crank and I don't wanna do that. So I've got work to do now. Yay. Updates whenever I get it back together. I'm not in a rush. Although I'd rather it done sooner than later because I want the car ~out of my life~

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[JustinG]

ill sell ya a Prius