Automotive News Discussion

[Evan]

"Remember the last time Germany and Japan teamed up, and how that went?"

[Sully]

I think my biggest problem with it is that stupid looking beak. Look up Supra concepts and you mainly get the ft1 which is what I was talking about in my previous post and that looks like a better version of this that actually looks less concepty than the current crazy lined design. And then I also saw some fan renders that just looked like a really clean modern mkIv which also would be better than this. But like everyone else is saying, they've been teasing a Supra since pretty much the 86 came out and this is all they could do? Add a bunch of stupid body lines to a z4.

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[ScottyB]

and now sales will flop because it looks like a wax model left in the sun, and Toyota will say "see we told you nobody buys sports cars! what a waste of time, thanks for proving us right, back to the next Prius refresh boys"

and with that we can kiss the MR2 bye forever

[CaptainHenreh]

and now sales will flop because it looks like a wax model left in the sun, and Toyota will say "see we told you nobody buys sports cars!  what a waste of time, thanks for proving us right, back to the next Prius refresh boys"  

and with that we can kiss the MR2 bye forever

And not only that, but the base Supra will have less power than the BRZ/86?

Fuckin' wat

[JPolen01]

And not only that, but the base Supra will have less power than the BRZ/86?

Fuckin' wat

They haven't confirmed the US will see that baby motor. At least as of yesterday.

[JPolen01]

Well who's ready for an absurdly overpriced Supra? Barrett Jackson is auctioning one off on 1/19 in Scottsdale. 100% of proceeds to charity so at least there's that.

[RawrImAMonster]

I'm guessing everyone has seen this being passed around by now, but man it's sad to think this is what it could have been. Maybe they'll come to their senses and at least fix the front bumper in a refresh.

[JPolen01]

Meh. A front bumper is a very easy fix for the aftermarket world. If you can get Toyota to fix the absurd flare and fake vent on the door then we are talking...

[RawrImAMonster]

Yeah but the stock headlights are terrible too. If they had just cut that weird tail off like the render, they would be perfectly fine.

[Senor_Taylor]

I have it even more now. Thanks.

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[Sully]

Ft-1 ft-1 ft-1....

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[Goodspeed]

So I just found out these Rivian electric vehicles are a thing and I love them.



https://products.rivian.com/

Maybe it's a novelty of the burgeoning electric car industry that every new vehicle reveal feels FRESH and EXCITING, but this really strikes me as some clean-sheet, inventive awesomeness.  There's so much copying going on these days in the "traditional" car world, that its just great to see something unique, and as simple and clean as that snowboard storage compartment/sleeping pod.  They feel like they were rolled off of a time-machine barge.

Late 2020 customer deliveries, $69k for the truck, $72 for the SUV starting price.

[Sijray21]

i was also hoping for a look more in-line with how the mkiv supra was designed (specifically the taillights). the rest of the car is still quite a bit busy...

I am happy that they made the car anyway. I'm thankful it isn't some sort of sport SUV or some other crap like that.

[Jake]

So I just found out these Rivian electric vehicles are a thing and I love them.

Maybe it's a novelty of the burgeoning electric car industry that every new vehicle reveal feels FRESH and EXCITING, but this really strikes me as some clean-sheet, inventive awesomeness.  There's so much copying going on these days in the "traditional" car world, that its just great to see something unique, and as simple and clean as that snowboard storage compartment/sleeping pod.  They feel like they were rolled off of a time-machine barge.

Late 2020 customer deliveries, $69k for the truck, $72 for the SUV starting price.

I'm very excited to see how these turn out. My biggest concern with an electric pickup truck/large SUV is how the range will decrease when towing. And then, how fast can it be re-juiced? I'd LOVE an electric truck but not if I have to take an hour on the way home from VIR to get more "gas".

[JPolen01]

^The good thing is that we are at the forefront of battery technology. I'm sure these won't be able to tow heavy loads or long distance at first. They are also likely designed for more home owner applications like trips to home Depot and to the kids baseball games. Just like trucks now.

In the future we will see replaceable battery packs so that you can swing by a station, change the battery, and get back on the road in a few minutes rather than wait to charge.

Is that a Chinese electric vehicle company? Never heard of it before.

[ScottyB]

i just want to know where the hell Rivian came from. Tesla was ramping up the PR machine for years, and here this brand comes out of the woodwork with 2 (what look to be) fully fleshed out trucks and unique architecture that clearly took some big manpower to engineer.

i hope they're a success. i love the practicality of an electric vehicle, and with a truck there's so much performance potential in a high torque electric motor if you can just find a way to make the range issues practical.

[Goodspeed]

I'm very excited to see how these turn out. My biggest concern with an electric pickup truck/large SUV is how the range will decrease when towing. And then, how fast can it be re-juiced? I'd LOVE an electric truck but not if I have to take an hour on the way home from VIR to get more "gas".

That's my biggest question too - the guy in the video talked up the towing capability a lot in terms of high payload vs awesome torque, but I didn't notice anything about range.  They must know that question is going to be on everyone's mind so hopefully they deliver.  Apparently the R1T (truck) has a 400 mile range, so being able to do Nova -> VIR, ~230 miles with 4-5k lbs behind you would be awesome.

Is that a Chinese electric vehicle company? Never heard of it before.

i just want to know where the hell Rivian came from.  Tesla was ramping up the PR machine for years, and here this brand comes out of the woodwork with 2 (what look to be) fully fleshed out trucks and unique architecture that clearly took some big manpower to engineer.  

I was curious to find out too.  To especially the casual autoshow observer (me) they just came out of nowhere.  Those who follow the electric car industry more closely have some answers:

https://insideevs.com/rivian-automotive-history-future/

Turns out they've been around since 2009, and have just been playing a sly, shadowy long game until their surprise announcements.  In the era of dumb-assed glacial NSX & Supra reveals...I like that.  They're an American company, HQ'ed in Michigan, with offices in California & the UK.  They bought Mitsubishi's former factory in Normal, Illinois for production.  

Speaking of the Supra - this is a good article that I think sums up a lot of feelings about the car.  I know they took the words right out of my mouth - I'd love to be a fly on the wall of Tetsuya Tada's office right now.  I'm still warm and cold on this car in different ways, but I don't think anyone can deny that the reception has been largely mixed-to-negative (the comments on Toyota's social media outlets are all fairly brutal, for example), especially as the glitter of the show fades and reality sets in:

https://www.autoblog.com/2019/01/14/2020...auto-show/



I don't think I've ever witnessed such a clash between pent-up desire and expectations, and the reality of the product for one single model of car.  The R34 GT-R dipped out in late '02, and the R35 landed in late '08 and was a world-beater.  There have been some grumblings about moves Porsche, BMW, etc. have made in the past, but I'm not sure they reached quite the fever pitch of this car's reception for so many people (I'm thinking general marque stuff like Bangle butt, fake engine audio, etc).  The water-cooling of the 911, maybe, but somebody clue me in if I'm missing another example of this magnitude as I'm drawing a blank.

I get that this car was born into a shrinking segment, and I never expected Toyota to forge their own I-6 and other large parts fitting a segment they hadn't touched in two decades for a single car that will sell in minuscule numbers.  So many people are posting absurd unrealized expectations that are totally untethered from the reality of the constraints in auto manufacturing.  "Why didn't they just re-introduce the MKIV?".  Bruh.  BRUH.  Come on.  At the same time, I think Toyota totally underestimated the responsibility they held, whether they asked for it or not, to get this car as-right-as-possible in the minds of literally millions of 90's JDM, Gran Turismo, and F&F fans.  As the article made clear, maybe 5% of buyers or those of serious interest in this car are going to be people who have never heard the word "Supra" before.  After the bubble economy popped, Toyota spent many years distancing themselves from the MKIV in their eco-push of the last near-20 years (discontinuing parts, taking their cars out of video games, etc.) and never cared for the model to near the extent Nissan did the GT-R, Mazda the RX-7, etc.  I honestly think they were out of touch to the extent that they felt it'd be OK to phone-in the car that once stood for the best design & engineering one of the largest and most successful manufacturers ever could muster.  While I'm still overall glad that the nameplate is back in....some....form and that a new sports car in general is on the market, and we do owe the suits at Toyota credit for that, I can't say that I feel sorry for Toyota receiving a fair amount of heat over their end product.

I still hope it's well-received enough for them to continue the model into a 6th gen. that fully restores the Supra name.

[Jake]

It might be slight sacrilege, but I really enjoyed this bit from Jack Baruth about the new Supra. He does have a point.

https://www.roadandtrack.com/new-cars/a2...crossover/

[JPolen01]

I never took the time to think about the LC500. But he's not wrong about that either.

[.RJ]

At the same time, I think Toyota totally underestimated the responsibility they held, whether they asked for it or not, to get this car as-right-as-possible in the minds of literally millions of 90's JDM, Gran Turismo, and F&F fans. 

And those fans that grew up with those things now are adults with money in a strong economy to spend on stupid things like cars.

I dont hate the new Supra. I think it looks neat, but I cant get over the fact that its a re-wrapped Z4. Maybe if they had done the interior different instead of lifting the dash straight out of the BMW bin and they didnt do the same thing with the FRS, I'd feel better. I also hate that its not a manual but I'm in the minority on that one - I am sure BMW is behind that as their engineers have stated a pretty clear disdain for the 3-pedal arrangement and they are only doing it for the M2 & M3 because they'd lose half their sales otherwise.

But I do hope it sells well and the sports car market gets some life back into it. You're up next, Mazda & Nissan.