Debate tonight

[G.Irish]

Its good to see Bush identifies with the common man's struggle to govern one's bitches

[Dragon]

I wonder if he prefers the chocker collar or the standard dog collar for that leash to be attached to.

[Kaan]

i was thinking more along the lines of pink fuzzy handcuffs

[Feersty]

Oh Bush, you're so funny... but if you get re-elected, i'm leaving the country

Maybe you can work for AOL in another country. I don't see you following through on this if President Bush is relected.

[Mike]

Weeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeellllls </drunken slur>

the drunken slur is the key.

[JackoliciousLegs]

Oh Bush, you're so funny... but if you get re-elected, i'm leaving the country

I don't see you following through on this if President Bush is relected.

lol... Yeah, I'm way WAYYY too american to leave the country :roll:

[83Rabbit]

"To say that there's only one focus in the war on terror doesn't really understand the nature of war on terror. Of course we're after uhh Saddam Hussein I mean uh Bin Laden.."

JESUS CHRIST MAN!

You missed a crucial part of that.

"To say that there's only one focus in the war on terror doesn't really understand the nature of war on terror. Of course we're after uhh Iraq uh.... Saddam Hussein I mean uh Bin Laden.."

Kerry did a decent job and Bush did better than he did in 2000 which is all that can be asked of him. I liked that Bush's head would bob when he was making a point and that he'd start smiling when he thought he made a good one. If it was a really good point, he'd chuckle. Oh Bush, you're so funny... but if you get re-elected, i'm leaving the country

Bush says we're strengthening our ties with allies. Wrong. Just plain: wrong. Bush, and it seems, the rest of his followers, have a completely different view on how we should approach the world from Kerry and "silly liberals." Unilateral decisionmaking, solo imperialism, solo invasion of sovereign nations... these are characteristics of other great societies right before their downfall. Bush fails to see (or maybe to acknowledge) that we live in the world... not the US... the world. Being the most powerful nation in the world (or not so much) means working to strengthen ties with other nations. Not preemptively attacking a sovereign nation with a 4 country alliance. I'm not arguing about economics because to argue that a small tax cut shifted the economy either way would be giving a president undue credit (reagan... clinton) imo.

There are four things that frustrate me most about the republican party in general.

1. This idea "let's police the world." Someone may be developing WMDs. They never harmed us... ATTACK! That's like a cop pulling someone over, realizing he has a history of armed violence, and approaching the car while shooting... to make sure he can't do it again. Bush has not been getting foreign policy right.

2. The idea of "we're better than you." Why do you deserve to eat, while he doesn't? This entire american ideology now that "we deserve better." "Buy this, you deserve it." "Live richly." Are you a better person than that guy sitting on a street corner because he was born into poverty and decided that he wanted to be able to have fun too? He bought a bottle of alcohol because he wanted to feel like a real person too. Able to have fun too. Those places in Africa with people starving are getting less money under this administration because the wealthy deserve a tax break. More than policing the world, we need to help the world. Again, we live in the WORLD not the US. (2 refers to foreign aid and social programs)

3. Education after "preemptive safety." I'd rather have the money in the ISAT program. period. If you're out of school, than you haven't experienced budget cuts. If you were in school for the transition from Clinton to Bush, you felt it. I felt it. My friends felt it. We were recently rated 37th smartest in the world for science and tech. A C grade country won't survive in the long run.

4. I'm better than you, part 2. No gay marriage. I am not gay. I am for gay rights. What Bush tried to write into the constitution was one word "discrimination". They can't help it. We can finally just accept it. They deserve it because we are not better than them because we're hetero. We are equal. Equal demands equal protection under the law. That means no "civil unions" (although it would be a step). That's separate but equal. Gay marriage. Period.

On the other hand, under what circumstances would I consider bush.

1. Family affiliated with military. Everything from active service to DoD contracts.
2. I'm a large business owner (revenue above 120k)
3. I've never lived out of the US
4. I don't plan to travel much out of the US (maybe mexico, canada, europe)
5. I believe in "Ignorance is bliss"
6. I am Christian conservative and believe that my morals are indeed valid ones. And thus should be emparted on the rest of the fine people of this nation.
7. Education is only a priority because we want our children to focus on an American economy.
8. I deserve a gas guzzling car because I worked my ass off in school for one.
9. Gays can do whatever they want (we won't kill them)... but I won't accept it.
10. I deserve everything I worked for. It's just the luck of the draw (which side of the food chain you're born on)

Why I don't vote on the R ticket.
1. I don't want to profit from our preemptive wars. I will take a lower paying job if it means not working for a defense contractor.
2. I plan to run my own business (and have it be charitable)
3. I've lived outside the US and know that we live in the world, not just the US
4. I plan to be able to leave the US safely at some point to visit obscure places, or maybe live outside again
5. Ignorance is false bliss
6. I believe everyone is entitled to their beliefs. Don't push it on anyone else. (Sorry if I offend any evangelicals we may have)
On a side note, my best friends in Uganda were both missionaries. I don't judge people for doing that, I just don't agree. I see what it does to societies.
7. Education is a HUGE priority in the GLOBAL economy.
8. I deserve a gas guzzling car because I worked my ass off in college for it.
9. Gays can do whatever they want, as long as they don't try to get with me. Yes, that means they should be able to wed.
10. If you are priveleged enough to eat richly every day, we owe it to those who didn't have that start to try to give them that opportunity.

jack... dont ever waste that much time writing a post of that legnth ever again.... i should smack you in the head, or publish this novel for you. hock:

[JackoliciousLegs]

Polls: Kerry won debate
Bush post-convention lead 'erased'!

Newsweek's post-debate poll showed 61 percent of respondents said Kerry won, 19 percent said Bush won and 16 percent said they were undecided.

Newsweek's post-convention poll had Bush leading among registered voters 54 percent to 43 percent. Its post-debate poll had 47 percent choosing Kerry-Edwards, and 45 percent for Bush-Cheney.

[damnit458]

Polls: Kerry won debate
Bush post-convention lead 'erased'!

Newsweek's post-debate poll showed 61 percent of respondents said Kerry won, 19 percent said Bush won and 16 percent said they were undecided.

Newsweek's post-convention poll had Bush leading among registered voters 54 percent to 43 percent. Its post-debate poll had 47 percent choosing Kerry-Edwards, and 45 percent for Bush-Cheney.

I just read that article this morning.
How do you think the Edwards vs Cheney debate will go? Id probably choose edwards as the winner, but to be honest im not to sure about either vp candidate

[JackoliciousLegs]

Cheney's a very smart guy. He's also strong balled... gotta have strong balls to want to outlaw gay marriages when your daughter is gay.

Edwards is a smart guy, but almost seems too nice to compete with Cheney... I think Edwards will lose. I just hope it's not too bad.

[damnit458]

Cheney's a very smart guy. He's also strong balled... gotta have strong balls to want to outlaw gay marriages when your daughter is gay.

Edwards is a smart guy, but almost seems too nice to compete with Cheney... I think Edwards will lose. I just hope it's not too bad.

Should be interesting. Hopefull ill have a tv to watch it this time...probably not

[G.Irish]

Well one is a lawyer, the other has been around the political block a few times. The one thing that could make stuff ugly is if Edwards brings up Halliburton or Cheney's connections to Enron.

But still, my pick would have to be Cheney. He has a lot more experience and background than Edwards and I'm sure he could embarass Edwards just on his sheer knowledge.

[ButtDyno]

Cheney is more likely to look like an ogre, however

[BLINGMW]

Cheney is more likely to look like an ogre, however

and more likely to lose by heart attack.

[Evan]

The one thing that could make stuff ugly is if Edwards brings up Halliburton or Cheney's connections to Enron.

The Halliburton and Enron connections arent much more than conspiracy-theory fodder, I doubt Edwards would bring it up (although he is a democrat.... :wink: ) and Edwards actually had some similarly shady stock purchases which Im sure Cheney would be prepared to counter with if necessary.
Some heavy hitting ammunition that Cheney has at his disposal would beEdwards and his learjet lawyer bretheren direct responsibility for much of the ballooned Healthcare costs that are a hot topic in the election (and ironically something JK/JE have attacked GWB about), and also John Kerry's own statements that Edwards is too inexperienced to be a suitable leader.

[G.Irish]

I wouldn't call Cheney's Halliburton and Enron connections conspiracy fodder considering he is still receiving bonus payments from Halliburton and he claimed executive privilege on some of his meeting with Enron when he was drafting an energy plan.

Still, the fact that Edwards was a malpractice lawyer means that Cheney could probably stomp him into the ground if things became personal. And as you said, Edwards is very inexperienced on the national stage. I could see Cheney running rings around him.

[Maengelito]

I could see Cheney running rings around him.

and more likely to lose by heart attack.

[BLINGMW]

yup, that oughta do it! :lol:

[Jess]

Anyone watch the Veep debate? Chan and I thought this was the best remark of the night:

from msn.com article:
Continuing to address Edwards directly in violation of the ground rules, Cheney said: ÔÇ£YouÔÇÖve got one of the worst attendance records in the United States Senate. Now, in my capacity as vice president, I am the president of the Senate, the presiding officer. IÔÇÖm up in the Senate most Tuesdays when theyÔÇÖre in session. The first time I ever met you was when you walked on the stage tonight.ÔÇØ

ZING!

[ButtDyno]

Yeah, it is seriously f'd up how infrequently your average rep/senator actually shows up to vote...

john