A little more info on the BMW 1-Series

[D_Eclipse9916]

Urea Injection reduces emissions but I don't know about the "makes it horribly expensive to maintain a diesel". The EPA hated the idea because it's something the owner had to maintain, but they (the epa) have such strict NOx and Particulate emissions standards that basically nobody can reach it for passenger cars. VW could only do it because our up-to-just-a-little-while-ago engine was like 4 generations old.

It's simple chemistry. A leaner (and therefore more fuel efficient and "green") combustion creates more oxides of nitrogen. The EPA wants to have a magic box where the only exhaust is water vapor and sunshine, and they don't want any unicorn piss injection system to do it.

Say that to new Ford diesel owners...or is it chevy diesel owners???? I am trying to remember. Heard bad stories of the urea injection taking up hours in labor. Its not just a simple "fill up". Its just another tihng to maintain increasing diesel costs.


PS- Mercedes and BMWs Urea Injection at about 7 gallon tanks go about 10-15k miles. So basically every oil change on those cars. And at $7.50 a gallon base, your looking at an additional 60 bucks and oil change, everything adds up.

[D_Eclipse9916]

Fail on me, apparently manufacturers are addressing these issues by trying to make the Urea Injection more easily refilled. The horror stories were just of past cars, not necessarily new cars.

[Evan]

wait....urea as in, its literally injecting piss into the exhaust?


funny this thread got bumped, I was just thinking how the 1 series, at least from my perception, has been a sales failure.

[BLINGMW]

gee, I wonder what it could have been if it were in any way significantly different from the 3-series? It's very slightly smaller, 100 lbs less, a little cheaper, and less useful. Hey BMW, how about that diesel hatch we all thought we were getting 2 years ago?

[D_Eclipse9916]

wait....urea as in, its literally injecting piss into the exhaust?


funny this thread got bumped, I was just thinking how the 1 series, at least from my perception, has been a sales failure.

Yes your pee includes some Urea, but the DEF that they are talking about is 65% deionized water, 35% pure Urea (no ur Urine is not pure UREA, but does contain a good amount).

I dont know, 1 series doesnt seem like a failure to me :dunno: Anybody got any sales figures?

[Evan]

wait....urea as in, its literally injecting piss into the exhaust?


funny this thread got bumped, I was just thinking how the 1 series, at least from my perception, has been a sales failure.

Yes your pee includes some Urea, but the DEF that they are talking about is 65% deionized water, 35% pure Urea (no ur Urine is not pure UREA, but does contain a good amount).

I dont know, 1 series doesnt seem like a failure to me :dunno: Anybody got any sales figures?

urea and water....yup sounds like piss! :lol:
urea is an organic compound originating only from metabolism of animals. now its made synthetically
ill fill up your piss tank for half the $60 the dealership charges!


these are some sales figures by model for this year

Sales BMW of North America, LLC, May 2009

YTD YTD
May 09 May 08 % May 09 May 08 %

1 Series 1,010 1,765 -42.8% 4,575 4,386 4.3%
3 Series 8,621 11,913 -27.6% 34,525 50,327 -31.4%
Z4 Roadster and Coupe 334 549 -39.2% 459 3,229 -85.8%
5 Series 3,904 3,899 0.1% 18,050 19,572 -7.8%
6 Series 268 661 -59.5% 1,852 3,083 -39.9%
7 Series 648 1,097 -40.9% 2,390 6,370 -62.5%
BMW passenger cars 14,785 19,884 -25.6% 61,851 86,967 -28.9%



so the cheaper 1 series is outsold by the 3 series by a factor of 8?

that really doesnt sound like an entry model, it should sell the best.


I rarely see them on the road here. And nova is a german luxury car douche parade .
Chan is right, you go look at the 1, and see the 3 which is a bigger, better, more capable, better looking car for only a little bit more. 1 series makes no sense for how it is priced.
And I really really really wanted to like it.

[G.Irish]

Honestly I wouldn't have expected the 1 series to outsell the 3 series but an annual sales rate of about 12000 units is pretty pathetic. I would've thought they could've sold at least 40k units a year.

I'm not even really looking forward to see used prices go down because it's such a heavy car that it really doesn't make much sense to me. Might as well get the 3 series.

[Evan]

M series 1 (dont call it an M1....)
<!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/car/10q4/2012_bmw_1-series_m_coupe-prototype_drive">http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/car/10q4/2012_bmw_1-series_m_coupe-prototype_drive</a><!-- m -->

pretty good value for the money, better engine/ +35hp, flares and bodywork, m3 suspension and LSD, m interior for $6k over 135i price
(which quite frankly just shows how overpriced the 135 is)

[G.Irish]

Yeah for $43k it's a much better value for the money than the 135i is. 3300 lbs is still kind of heavy but at least it's a little bit lighter than the 135i (I think?) and it's lighter than the E46 M3. I still don't know that I'd buy it since there are a lot of other really good cars in that price range but it looks like a decent deal.

[D_Eclipse9916]

Can I predict a stripped and caged 1 series M with an e92 m3 motor in it.......drooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooool.

[G.Irish]

1M laps Hockenheim faster than M3:http://www.1addicts.com/forums/showthread.php?t=520618

This just confirms my belief that the current M3 is too fat. But, a good start for the 1M, just imagine how quick it would be if they could make it even lighter and cranked up the boost a bit.

[D_Eclipse9916]

Not surprised, they are replacing the M3 soon, its pretty old and the 3 series is the new 5 series. I still think the 1m is too fat and should have been 2800lbs and 250 NA horsepower.

[G.Irish]

Not surprised, they are replacing the M3 soon, its pretty old and the 3 series is the new 5 series. I still think the 1m is too fat and should have been 2800lbs and 250 NA horsepower.

I agree 3300 lbs is still too much but the 1-series shares its platform with the 3-series so that's why it's heavy for its size. I'm Even if it did have it's own platform I don't think they'd be able to get down to 2800 lbs without using some exotic materials. FWD econoboxes weigh 2800 lbs these days, unlikely that BMW would be able to get down that low for a RWD luxo coupe. 3000-3100 lbs would be about what I think they could achieve realistically if the 1 was on it's own platform.

But yeah, I'd prefer less weight rather than more power with the 1. I'd be much happier with a lighter 1 series with maybe 200 n/a horsepower than a porker with 300 hp.