Lexus LF-A

[CaptainHenreh]

Yeah, same here. Why can't any japanese car companys put out a car with more than 400HP and not fuck it up by pricing it so ridiculous?

In this case, the price is in no way rediculous for what you would be getting. Make no mistake, Lexus isn't going for the 25-35 year old market and screwing up royally in the process...they are building an all out supercar for.....a supercar price. Its like asking for the base Ferrari to be in the 30k dollar range.

And how good has Japan been at the exotic segment?

The underpowered NSX was their only try. 100 grand? For a Japanese GT car? I'll have an Aston, thanks.

[Goodspeed]

And how good has Japan been at the exotic segment?

The underpowered NSX was their only try. 100 grand? For a Japanese GT car? I'll have an Aston, thanks.

The NSX wasn't a success in terms of sales, but it was a fantastic car. It was just panned by critics for having no "soul" like a Ferrari or Porsche, which it was a better performer than and it didn't break down and leak oil everywhere like the other offerings of the time.

Lexus has been gaining a lot of steam lately, with their IS and LS sedans taking a large chunk out of BMW and Mercedes, and their highest reliability ratings in the country. Why won't they be able to do the same in the super sports car segment? I haven't heard one good reason.

[CaptainHenreh]

Why won't they be able to do the same in the super sports car segment? I haven't heard one good reason.

I just gave you one! The only example from the "Porsche/Ferrari GT" wasn't a failure by an measurement...but!

#1: It wasn't Toyota, who seems to have lost their way when it comes to making fast things.
#2: It wasn't a HUGE success.

Finally, while Lexus may make fine luxury cars, that doesn't mean that they know shit one about how to make an exotic. I mean, look at the SC430. A cool car, if you're a 45 year old woman with leather skin and green hair.

I guess all my venom stems from Toyota's apparent utter inability to make an affordable sports car. When I say "affordable" I don't necessarily mean "a $18,000 hot hatch", although that would certainly be welcome. But a Corvette-class sports car, maybe something with, say, I don't know, a turbo inline six? Or a nice, small displacement V8? I mean, THE PLATFORM IS THERE, what's the malfunction?!??! Geez, give me a Tremec and a Sawzall, and a pair of turbos and I could probably carve it myself out of an IS350. What's Toyota's problem? I want the Toyota that made the AE86, not the bunch of mealy-mouth pansies that shit out the Prius and this "LF-XGA89 Hybrid Spacefucker 5000".

[HAULN-SS]

hah...I got to "Spacefucker" before I had to laugh out loud

[Goodspeed]

What's Toyota's problem? I want the Toyota that made the AE86, not the bunch of mealy-mouth pansies that shit out the Prius and this "LF-XGA89 Hybrid Spacefucker 5000".

I totally agree, but therein lies our differences. You want Toyota to build good, affordable sports cars, I just want Toyota to build any sports car, even if its a 150k beast that none of us will ever be able to afford. I'm just glad they are seeming to come around with this and the FT-HS. Oh wait...the FT-HS!! Thats what you're taking about. It'll be a Corvette class sports car with a Corvette class (probably cheaper) price. Though I agree with you and am always a bit skeptic, I just see this as the beginning of possibly something very good for Toyota, the Japanese sports car segment, and sports cars in general.

[Mike]

lexus building a corvette class car for less than a corvette? you've lost me now...

[CaptainHenreh]

What's Toyota's problem? I want the Toyota that made the AE86, not the bunch of mealy-mouth pansies that shit out the Prius and this "LF-XGA89 Hybrid Spacefucker 5000".

You want Toyota to build good, affordable sports cars, I just want Toyota to build any sports car, even if its a 150k beast that none of us will ever be able to afford...Oh wait...the FT-HS!! Thats what you're taking about. It'll be a Corvette class sports car with a Corvette class...

Again don't see this as a personal attack or anything, it's not...but a 6 month old, one time deal, "Hybrid Sports Concept" does not excite me. Wake me when they actually make something. The Chevy Nomad concept was totally cool also, and it ended up in the trashcan...and Chevy actually makes sports cars*!

So you'll forgive me if my excitement is reserved when the company that brought us the Celica GTS4, AE86, MR2 and Supra hands us this luxocoupe shitbox as it's "return to sports cars". I piss on it. English has no insult vile enough for this "New Lexus Sports Car".

Nissan Gets It. Mazda Gets It. Honda totally gets it. (You see a hybrid S2000 around here? FUCK NO. For a reason.) Hell, even Hyundai might get it. (V8 Rear Drive coupe in the works?) But Toyota? "Oh, Hybrid Technology! Corolla Camry! Best selling car in America! Look, NASCAR!"

Man, FUCK Toyota. Someone come get me when they find their dicks.



*sort of.

[JackoliciousLegs]

HAHAHA... man you're on a roll. I'm with you. Toyota has been lame since 95. I'm not creative enough to rival "LF-XGA89 Hybrid Spacefucker 5000".

[Goodspeed]

lexus building a corvette class car for less than a corvette? you've lost me now...

The FT-HS will be made by Toyota, its been green lighted for 2009. 400+ hp, 35k ish price, blablabla

Rex, honestly, I have no idea wtf is wrong with Japanese auto execs. For example, they want to significantly raise the price of the Tundra to cover unexpected extra costs in making the Texas plant where it is built. But I don't think its realistic to not like a car for advanced technology which we all knew was coming. Mazda gets it? Have you seen some of their latest weird as shit concept cars like the Kabura or whatever? The future looks grim for them if you don't like hybrid, odd looking sports cars. I know they have that little thing called the Miata, which is much....much more than Toyota can say. But don't think I'm defending Toyota, I just sorta like what they're doing now.

[JackoliciousLegs]

Mazda gets it?

Yes. Have you driven an RX-8? A new mx-5? A 6? A 3? They're all very fun cars. Mazda's never been up for competing with the big dogs, but they always make low cost, fun cars.

[Goodspeed]

Mazda gets it?

Yes. Have you driven an RX-8? A new mx-5? A 6? A 3? They're all very fun cars. Mazda's never been up for competing with the big dogs, but they always make low cost, fun cars.

I know they do now, I was referring to the future...every single concept they have shown appears to be the essence of what Rex hates, weird hybrid futuristic electric fiberglass reinforced plastic dickwarmers. But there is talk of a new "true" RX7 successor in the works. I agree that Toyota has lost its penis, but I'm just glad they they appear to be growing it back...a little bit.

[CaptainHenreh]

Mazda gets it? Have you seen some of their latest weird as shit concept cars like the Kabura or whatever?

I get what you're saying but concepts are SUPPOSED to be outrageous! Here's the difference:

Mazda has:
Mazdaspeed3
Mazdaspeed6
RX-8
MX-5

Toyota has:

Nissan has:
Sentra SE-R Spec V (now with 200hp!)
Altima 3.5 (Cool whether you like it or not)
350Z
G35 (Coupe and sedan and Manual Trans and AWD, Zee-Oh-Em-Gee!)
Forthcoming GTR

Toyota has:

Honda has:
Civic Si
S2000

Toyota has:

See? The BEST, and the very absolute best Toyota can do is the tC, which basically gets it's ass handed to it by everything and the IS250, which is a shadow of it's former self. Oh wait, and the X-Runner :roll: .

So while Mazda and the gang may make goofy, ass-ugly sports concepts, their production backs up their shit.

This is not a Japanese Executive problem. This is a Toyota problem.

And until Toyota proves to me that this isn't just a "testing the waters" kind of thing, and when it sells like shit they go "Oh, see, American does not want sports cars.", then I'll STFU about Toyota and not a minute before.

[Goodspeed]

Well, lets look at it from Toyota's perspective. If they aren't already, they will be the worlds No. 1 automaker sometime this year. They have generated skyrocketing profits, they are market leaders virtually on every continent, and if it means a damn thing, they are the world's current leader of hybrid technology. (And the lauded Mazda is trying to catch up in that segment).

All of that without a sports car of any kind.

Now, seemingly content with their achievement of world domination, they seem to be getting their feet wet in the sports/performance car market with various upcoming offerings, which, in the case of the FT-HS and IS-F, are slated for production. (And you don't put two concepts out on the 'ring for nothing, so thats coming too)

Sport sedans: BMW M5, Audi RS4, C63 AMG, Caddy CTS-V, Lexus IS-F
Sport coupes: Chevy Corvette, Porsche Boxster/Cayman, Nissan 350Z, tons more, Toyota FT-HS
Luxury GT/Supercars: Aston Martin DBS, Porsche 911 Turbo, Ferrari 599/612, AMG SL, Lexus LF-A

So its not like they aren't at least trying. Sure, they are years late, they completely ignored pleas from American Toyota execs for a new sports car, and you might find that their future offerings suck. No, they don't have a 20k dollar Miata fighter, for reasons beyond me so I can only assume that they are infantile retards for refusing to build something light, fun, and cheap.

But thats business. Toyota has perhaps realized that the life of the sports car may soon come to an end among emissions and crash safety regulations, and maybe they have swiftly jumped a decade ahead of the game to ensure their continued automotive dominance in a world of rolling appliances. They may have lost anyone who cares about automotive performance, but they'll be lining their coffers for some time to come.

My point, again, is that I'm glad they seem to be at least dabbling with sports/performance cars once again. Its something. I like Toyota for the very cars you mentioned that have since come and gone, so I'm very interested in their future with these cars. But if they fail and Toyota blames everyone else but themselves, we can go firebomb their dealer's lots of Priuseseses together :wink:

[.RJ]

The alphabet soup vehicle naming gives me a headache...

[CaptainHenreh]

The IS-F? A Sports Sedan? Rofl. Not even in the same league as the M5, RS4, or AMG Anything.

Like I said, when Toyota finds their balls, come get me.

And as far as hybrid Mazdas go, or for that matter hybrid anything goes, who gives a shit? There are two reasons hybrids get better fuel economy than their gas equivalents:

1: Stopping the engine at a stop (whups, unless you want a/c)
2: Regenerative braking.

That's it! "Hybrid Technology" is a buzzword with a limited application, (that, sadly, we'll probably see in most all cars, see Chevy's "hybrid")especially at the current price. (See: waste of money lexus hybrids, and Honda realizing the Hybrid Accord wasn't worth a shit either.)

Sorry, again, I don't see what the big deal is. I don't care how many automotive toasters Toyota has sold without a sports car. I don't care how much money they've made, or what kind of markets they lead. That Does Not Matter To Me. In my opinion, they are soulless bastards in the same league as Kia, only a little more painful because I remember what they used to be.

[ScottyB]

"LF-XGA89 Hybrid Spacefucker 5000".

hahaha....oh man. you need to write a book dude.


does anyone else here not totally love this alphanumeric car name deal?

[WRXtranceformed]

That, and AZN engine names always seem to be a billion letters. 2JZ-GTE123091085, VQ230952305920, B18ca2321069 etc.

[HAULN-SS]

Dude! Everybody knows real cars get numbers, not names! Don't you remember the Pontiac 6000LE?

[HAULN-SS]

[CaptainHenreh]

That, and AZN engine names always seem to be a billion letters. 2JZ-GTE123091085, VQ230952305920, B18ca2321069 etc.

See, here I'll disagree with you. I think that Japanese engine codes are, for the most part, totally reasonable.

We'll contrast LS6 with VQ35

LS6. L=? S=? 6=? This could mean the OLD big block 454 or the new aluminum "HO" 5.7 in the Z06. But the letters don't really mean anything.

VQ35
V=V engine (4 cylinder gets more complicated, but if it's a v6 or v8 made by nissan, it starts with a V)
Q= engine series (As opposed to others, like G or H)
35 = Displacement. Contrast with VQ30, a 3.0, or VQ37.

See how much sense that makes? Toyota's a little more difficult, but you get more information.

2JZ-GTE
2 - second engine in the family
JZ - engine family
G - "sport" cylinder head as opposed to F "economy" cylinder head
T - Turbo
E - "electronic" fuel injection.

I have no problem with this. It gives you all the information about the engine you need, right in the name. I don't mind alphabet cars when they make SENSE. 528i means it's a 5 series with a 2.8 liter engine. This makes sense. TSX doesn't. That's stupid. LH-F? Stupid.