Madison MoneySports - Personal Finance Thread

[Senor_Taylor]

So why are we all having kids?

[Kaan]

So why are we all having kids?

1. some folks have a desire for a mini me
2. they come alone with some really nice tax breaks (outside looking in)
3. related to #2... someone has to pay our state and federal debts for us... through taxes (aka make new tax payers)
4. peer pressure? i cant tell you how many folks have said "so when are you having kids?" ... to include parents and family... most of it has stopped. 

i wonder if sylvia still has the list we made on why not to have kids on her phone? its something we talked through a lot and made the decision not to have any.

[Apoc]

lulz @ tax breaks... just like marriage comes with tax breaks.

We never wanted kids. We even had a spreadsheet that scored all the reasons to have and not to have them. Then I got to about 35 and realized we'd already done most everything we wanted in DINK life. I remember asking myself, "what's the point of life?" around that time. After a lot of thought, the only real answer I could come up with was bringing life into the world and ensuring 1) it had a happy life, and 2) I used it as an opportunity to leave the world a better place than I found it.

You will be poorer and much more exhausted by having a kid. People like to talk about how that's all so worth it. Honestly, it's a wash in my mind... but I really enjoy getting to see the world for the first time all over again through his eyes. It's definitely the most self-less thing I've done in my lifetime.

[Senor_Taylor]

lulz @ tax breaks... just like marriage comes with tax breaks.

We never wanted kids. We even had a spreadsheet that scored all the reasons to have and not to have them. Then I got to about 35 and realized we'd already done most everything we wanted in DINK life. I remember asking myself, "what's the point of life?" around that time. After a lot of thought, the only real answer I could come up with was bringing life into the world and ensuring 1) it had a happy life, and 2) I used it as an opportunity to leave the world a better place than I found it.

You will be poorer and much more exhausted by having a kid. People like to talk about how that's all so worth it. Honestly, it's a wash in my mind... but I really enjoy getting to see the world for the first time all over again through his eyes. It's definitely the most self-less thing I've done in my lifetime.

Well said. I can respect people that have kids later in life. It befuddles me when I see people get married at 18 and have a kid at 20. Like... live your life.

[Sijray21]

lulz @ tax breaks... just like marriage comes with tax breaks.

We never wanted kids. We even had a spreadsheet that scored all the reasons to have and not to have them. Then I got to about 35 and realized we'd already done most everything we wanted in DINK life. I remember asking myself, "what's the point of life?" around that time. After a lot of thought, the only real answer I could come up with was bringing life into the world and ensuring 1) it had a happy life, and 2) I used it as an opportunity to leave the world a better place than I found it.

You will be poorer and much more exhausted by having a kid. People like to talk about how that's all so worth it. Honestly, it's a wash in my mind... but I really enjoy getting to see the world for the first time all over again through his eyes. It's definitely the most self-less thing I've done in my lifetime.

Well said. I can respect people that have kids later in life. It befuddles me when I see people get married at 18 and have a kid at 20. Like... live your life.

i'm in the same boat with Chris

the young families likely stems from their life experiences and possibly religious ones. you're supposed to get married and have kids because that's what god wants, right?

i will say that younger parents are more equipped to deal with youngsters since kids are so exhausting and sometimes stressful. You're likely to have more money and resources in your later years, but health and fitness? I was so tired in my mid-30s with a newborn/toddler i can't imagine dealing with one 10 years from now. Like having a kid when you're 45 and then dealing with the teenage years in your early 60s? no thanks; i'd probably have a stroke.

[Apoc]

Ten years more money for kid expenses or ten years more energy for chasing kids. Pick one.

Having a toddler at 40 was pretty terrible... but so is penny pinching for a family vacation @ 25.

[Kaan]

lulz @ tax breaks... just like marriage comes with tax breaks.

there are no write offs for getting married... there are for kids. now, you will spend WAY more on the kid than the write off gets you... but you get something to adjust that income.

getting married was the worst business decision we have ever made. we used to file seperately with two head of house holds... the only change was getting married and magically we owed taxes lol

[Apoc]

lulz @ tax breaks... just like marriage comes with tax breaks.

there are no write offs for getting married... there are for kids. 

Not entirely true. You get your wife's standard deduction when you get married, which matters if you aren't both full time. My wife was not.

I'd rather have a $12xxx deduction than a $2000 credit.

[ScottyB]

So why are we all having kids?

didn't mean to make it sound like i don't like being a dad and parenting is so much suck.  just jealous of people with close families who can be more carefree thanks to free daycare.

fwiw, we were "one and done" and its been really rewarding and fulfilling.  but we also didn't have him til i was 31.  can't imagine doing that straight out of college or something like that.

[Steve85]

So why are we all having kids?

It's weird to get your anger out yelling at youth soccer referee if you don't have a kid on the field.

[.RJ]

I was so tired in my mid-30s with a newborn/toddler i can't imagine dealing with one 10 years from now. Like having a kid when you're 45 and then dealing with the teenage years in your early 60s? no thanks; i'd probably have a stroke.

Ugh....

[Apoc]

I'll be 60 when my kid starts his senior year of college. Can't wait!

It's 100% true that we've decided if we want another, we're gonna foster to adopt a kid who is at least 5 y/o. Having a baby/toddler in our 40s is a no-go for us.

[HAULN-SS]

I didn't have a kid until I was 35. It's been pretty fun so far, and I like to think it's the first time I imagine what 2090 or so might look like.. Kind of like seeing the future.

[Kaan]

lulz @ tax breaks... just like marriage comes with tax breaks.

there are no write offs for getting married... there are for kids. 

Not entirely true. You get your wife's standard deduction when you get married, which matters if you aren't both full time. My wife was not.

I'd rather have a $12xxx deduction than a $2000 credit.

standard deduction for a single person is > a standard deduction for a married non working spouse (at least it used to be) because of the "head of household" deduction is taken away from one when someone gets married. I'm not sure the head of household still exists after the overhaul. 

you are also changing more than one variable... most folks cant afford to go to a single income.

[D_Eclipse9916]

You will be poorer and much more exhausted by having a kid. People like to talk about how that's all so worth it. Honestly, it's a wash in my mind... but I really enjoy getting to see the world for the first time all over again through his eyes. It's definitely the most self-less thing I've done in my lifetime.

Agreed.

I think it's more of an emotional decision vs any "rationale" decision.  Definitely poorer and wayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy more exhausted.

That said, it's opens your eyes to the world in a way you would never know.  I luckily got to do some amazing and cool things before kids; so I dont feel like I am missing much in terms of personal self-gain.  I have made a conscious choice to do things where I spend more time with my kids because I actually enjoy it over other things.  Do I get annoyed, exhausted, pissed off, blow my brains out frustrated? Yes, but it's a wash for the amazing perspective and time to spend with them.

DEFINITELY not suggesting people need to have kids, but personally if I did not; I would struggle with the whole "what's the point of life".  My uncle (upper 60s) struggles with not settling down and having kids, but he chose not to. All that money and success with no one to share it with. Humans are social creatures. I do think he and a lot of people have the "grass is greener" on both sides.

[Apoc]

you are also changing more than one variable... most folks cant afford to go to a single income.

hot take: many folks choose a life that requires two incomes, at least those who are college educated

My wife was not working when I was making less than half of what I make today. We are incredibly fortunate, but we made sacrifices to forgo her income.

[WRXtranceformed]

you are also changing more than one variable... most folks cant afford to go to a single income.

hot take: many folks choose a life that requires two incomes, at least those who are college educated

My wife was not working when I was making less than half of what I make today. We are incredibly fortunate, but we made sacrifices to forgo her income.

also could add:  many folks choose a location that requires two incomes, at least those who are college educated

[Senor_Taylor]

you are also changing more than one variable... most folks cant afford to go to a single income.

hot take: many folks choose a life that requires two incomes, at least those who are college educated

My wife was not working when I was making less than half of what I make today. We are incredibly fortunate, but we made sacrifices to forgo her income.

also could add:  many folks choose a location that requires two incomes, at least those who are college educated

Absolutely. With a world of fully remote work for a lot of us now, it's really nothing more than choice. I know this because I complain constantly, but don't consider moving far from the office for fear of moving away from the job market.

[.RJ]

DEFINITELY not suggesting people need to have kids, but personally if I did not; I would struggle with the whole "what's the point of life".  My uncle (upper 60s) struggles with not settling down and having kids, but he chose not to.  All that money and success with no one to share it with.  Humans are social creatures. I do think he and a lot of people have the "grass is greener" on both sides.

Yeah, I can see that and I'm at about that point now. But I know plenty of friends that are just fine without kids, also. I think its easy to get in a rut, but, with travel/hobbies/volunteer work/businesses etc there's lots of other rewards in life, although I wonder if I'll say the same thing when I'm much older than I am now.

[Apoc]

It wasn't until I got out of the DC rat race that I realized something was missing in my life. I think I just kept myself so busy with more, better, bigger that I didn't have time for much else. Traveled the world, had cars and motorcycles out the wazoo, owned a house, did pretend important things in my job, and it wasn't until I moved to the laid back west coast that I realized I had it all wrong. I think it was the "in service of others" being the meaning of life that I didn't get. If I had been doing more volunteer work, maybe it would have scratched that itch. It wasn't until five years after leaving DC that I even considered having a kid remotely possible. Now, I revel in the fact that none of that other shit matters because I'm either too exhausted or too occupied to give a fuck.