Madison MoneySports - Personal Finance Thread

[Tyler.M]

Let me tell you, these past 4 months have been tough as hell, more so emotionally than financially, for me. I'm one of the "lucky" ones that works in an essential industry (I guess candy-making is essential?) so I've been swamped with work plus 20% hazard pay. BUT all the other external stuff makes falling into old habits (retail therapy) hard to avoid.  I'm staying strong, but I'm like, one steam summer sale away from going back to the mindset that got me here in the first place. 

Refinanced my house though and shaved off 7 years off of my expected pay off date, which is good. Working nearly every weekend for some extra dough to continue to pay off my high interest debt. It's taken its toll but there's not really much else to do until recently because of COVID. I think I've paid off 30k this year in debt alone already and I'll have a 3 month emergency savings by December, assuming no surprises. Also, my credit score jumped like 60 points in 4 months putting me over 800 for the first time. Good shit. 

I'm struggling with the "I really want a fun car" thing right now when I'm still behind on maxing out my Roth contribution, necessary home repairs, and investments. I've read through all of this thread again and all of the "right" things to do but when the hell do you actually build up some money for a big unnecessary purchase like a track car?  Even after I get out of debt and start investing my money properly, I just don't see where I'll be able to have the cash to spend on an expensive racing hobby, or even a decently nice car anytime soon.   How do you guys fund this stuff or budget for it?

[Senor_Taylor]

Let me tell you, these past 4 months have been tough as hell, more so emotionally than financially, for me. I'm one of the "lucky" ones that works in an essential industry (I guess candy-making is essential?) so I've been swamped with work plus 20% hazard pay. BUT all the other external stuff makes falling into old habits (retail therapy) hard to avoid.  I'm staying strong, but I'm like, one steam summer sale away from going back to the mindset that got me here in the first place. 

Refinanced my house though and shaved off 7 years off of my expected pay off date, which is good. Working nearly every weekend for some extra dough to continue to pay off my high interest debt. It's taken its toll but there's not really much else to do until recently because of COVID. I think I've paid off 30k this year in debt alone already and I'll have a 3 month emergency savings by December, assuming no surprises. Also, my credit score jumped like 60 points in 4 months putting me over 800 for the first time. Good shit. 

I'm struggling with the "I really want a fun car" thing right now when I'm still behind on maxing out my Roth contribution, necessary home repairs, and investments. I've read through all of this thread again and all of the "right" things to do but when the hell do you actually build up some money for a big unnecessary purchase like a track car?  Even after I get out of debt and start investing my money properly, I just don't see where I'll be able to have the cash to spend on an expensive racing hobby, or even a decently nice car anytime soon.   How do you guys fund this stuff or budget for it?

Want to know how I afford three cars, a trailer, and all that stuff? I don't own a home. Lots of loans... and see the picture below.

To be fair, that's one of two bank accounts, but the other one is not much better.

Don't compare yourself to others. Most of us with cool stuff are just swimming in debt. You're doing the right thing.



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[Sijray21]

Let me tell you, these past 4 months have been tough as hell, more so emotionally than financially, for me. I'm one of the "lucky" ones that works in an essential industry (I guess candy-making is essential?) so I've been swamped with work plus 20% hazard pay. BUT all the other external stuff makes falling into old habits (retail therapy) hard to avoid.  I'm staying strong, but I'm like, one steam summer sale away from going back to the mindset that got me here in the first place.

I'm struggling with the "I really want a fun car" thing right now when I'm still behind on maxing out my Roth contribution, necessary home repairs, and investments. I've read through all of this thread again and all of the "right" things to do but when the hell do you actually build up some money for a big unnecessary purchase like a track car?  Even after I get out of debt and start investing my money properly, I just don't see where I'll be able to have the cash to spend on an expensive racing hobby, or even a decently nice car anytime soon.   How do you guys fund this stuff or budget for it.

One thing to remember is balance. If you're struggling a bit mentally offer yourself an outlet, one based on your goals and allowances. Ultimately you're the one setting the restrictions, so you can set the relief valves; no point in a plan if it blows up in your face. I think almost all of us struggle with the same predicament and it is especially difficult when your friends are spending a lot of money around you. Taylor's right to not compare yourself to others no matter how difficult that is to do. I feel most people also struggle a bit to fully commit to the 'maxing out 401(k) IRA contributions' thing since that's usually a lot per year when compared to income/expenses for most. I've put in quite a bit, but I've actually never done it (i'll be 37 this year); i'm on track this year.

Refinanced my house though and shaved off 7 years off of my expected pay off date, which is good. Working nearly every weekend for some extra dough to continue to pay off my high interest debt. It's taken its toll but there's not really much else to do until recently because of COVID. I think I've paid off 30k this year in debt alone already and I'll have a 3 month emergency savings by December, assuming no surprises. Also, my credit score jumped like 60 points in 4 months putting me over 800 for the first time. Good shit. 

This is fantastic! The paying off the house debt is a marathon and paying off high interest debt is great/important; keep it up. I was so relieved when we paid off my wife's student loans. We did have some windfalls though (Dieselgate and a small inheritance also helped in our case).

[Deceus]

Let me tell you, these past 4 months have been tough as hell, more so emotionally than financially, for me. I'm one of the "lucky" ones that works in an essential industry (I guess candy-making is essential?) so I've been swamped with work plus 20% hazard pay. BUT all the other external stuff makes falling into old habits (retail therapy) hard to avoid.  I'm staying strong, but I'm like, one steam summer sale away from going back to the mindset that got me here in the first place. 

Refinanced my house though and shaved off 7 years off of my expected pay off date, which is good. Working nearly every weekend for some extra dough to continue to pay off my high interest debt. It's taken its toll but there's not really much else to do until recently because of COVID. I think I've paid off 30k this year in debt alone already and I'll have a 3 month emergency savings by December, assuming no surprises. Also, my credit score jumped like 60 points in 4 months putting me over 800 for the first time. Good shit. 

I'm struggling with the "I really want a fun car" thing right now when I'm still behind on maxing out my Roth contribution, necessary home repairs, and investments. I've read through all of this thread again and all of the "right" things to do but when the hell do you actually build up some money for a big unnecessary purchase like a track car?  Even after I get out of debt and start investing my money properly, I just don't see where I'll be able to have the cash to spend on an expensive racing hobby, or even a decently nice car anytime soon.   How do you guys fund this stuff or budget for it?

I've made over six figures for the last 6 years. I haven't put a down payment on anything in that time. I don't have anything in retirement. I'm not drowning in debt but that's entirely too much money for entirely too long to have the negative net worth that I do. It weighs on me but I try not to dwell on it too much. What I have done is invest in myself skills-wise and fortunately will likely never be out of a high paying job for the rest of my life barring any kind of collapse of society. I try to focus on that and that the financial recklessness while stupid has brought a good bit of fulfillment to my life. My student loans should've been paid off years ago. I'm sure that's going to be a great feeling knocking those out but so was hearing my engine fire for the first time both on the stand and in the car.

My advice is just focus on your goals at hand and crush them, whatever they may be. Don't worry about the sacrifices or downsides. People being smart and paying down debt wish they were having more fun. People having fun wish they were smarter and paying down debt. I gave myself until I was 30 to prioritize fun and now I'm switching gears a bit. Sure had I prioritized being smart I could be swapping a hell cat crate into the Demon rather than the backyard hack job I did over the last few years but hey it was rewarding and that's what I choose to focus on. If I'm smart for the next 5 years, I can think about being dumb again but won't until then.

[D_Eclipse9916]

Honestly sounds like you are right on track. Get any debt non-home related paid off ASAP. But it’s just like anything in life: moderation. We have a finite number of years in life; so enjoy.

Like everyone else; don’t compare yourself to others. People typically white lie about their own finances (just like their salary).

Again, congratulations on getting yourself on the right track!! It’s super hard and lots of people struggle; so you are doing it!

[Tyler.M]

Honestly sounds like you are right on track.  Get any debt non-home related paid off ASAP. But it’s just like anything in life: moderation. We have a finite number of years in life; so enjoy.

Like everyone else; don’t compare yourself to others. People typically white lie about their own finances (just like their salary).

Again, congratulations on getting yourself on the right track!! It’s super hard and lots of people struggle; so you are doing it!

I appreciate that.  I've really only been on this track for a short time but it feels like forever, especially when I get into that "I WANT A CAR RIGHT NOW" mindset.  I also appreciate all the feedback you guys have given me, too. 

How do you guys go about increasing income? I'm on a 6 figure path (it varies with how much overtime I'm working but I'll be over 6 figures this year) which is good for living in Harrisonburg, but I'm sort of at the top end for what I can earn in what I do at my current level. I could grind out for 5 years and get promoted I guess (like a 15k bump) but I feel like my time would be better served elsewhere. I've tripled my income since graduating but my raises are starting to top out. I don't really have the time to do some passive income/side gig thing, either. I'm in production/warehousing/distribution management so I'm thinking a MBA would be a decent track since I have an English degree and no formal business training (and I can do that while I keep working). I'd also be interested in getting into a different industry as well like management for car/motorcycle manufacturing or industrial equipment, mainly just because it actually interests me. I work in food production now which is stable but not really my cup of tea. Just sort of where I landed.  

There are some professional certifications I'd like to get while I"m sort of in this limbo period like a PMP or a Six Sigma Belt and work should pay for some of that stuff.  Is there a good ROI on this sort of stuff or is this just like lighting money on fire?

[rherold9]

+1 on moderation and don't compare yourself to others. Find your balance, your goals, the best places to pay off debt you'd like, and go from there

One personal example:

I've been stock piling a bit of a safety net/liquid cash/maxing IRA with COVID happening. I'm 100% certain I have job security, but you never know. I've filled the void with a cheap Logitech sim setup to practice driving and gotten into biking quite a bit more. Once I reach my safety net goals I will focus back on the car, get it done, and get back out on track. I could currently finish my car, but then I wouldn't have the gross safety net I was looking for in the situation at hand

Edit: A few questions to ask yourself, is getting a cheap car enough to fill a void? Have you met your other goals or can keep them when buying the car? Could you find a balance with something else in the mean time? Do you not give a shit and just send it? Really up to you!

[HAULN-SS]

Sounds like a good call. Make sure you're focusing on the right debts. Never carry a credit card balance. I don't know what you refi'd at, but there's almost no point in paying ahead on a house. I know some people feel like that's an albatross around their neck, but with interest rates sub 5%, almost everything else beats it. Let your extra cash work for you. The house will get easier and easier to pay off the monthly note as time goes on, just based off standard raises. If you can go for a promotion or switch fields to something more lucrative, all the better. Switching fields is not a bad idea, but the sooner the better. I think certifications and such help in some areas, but I've never gotten one (software/networking field). Whenever I am interviewing someone, I look for genuine interest in the area they are looking to get into. Lastly, I think look at relocating. If you're talking about cars, there's not a whole hell of a lot of difference in what a BMW costs in Harrisonburg, vs what it costs in Northern Virginia. Yes, the cost of living might be more, but that's mostly referring to housing as far as I can tell. If you were to move, you'd likely make more, and have a higher cost for living somewhere, but a $600 car note is not going to seem like as big of a percentage of your monthly income. Whether you can stand the difference in the other living factors like traffic, crowds, or living in a smaller place is likely the main thing you'd have to think about. I think you'd also have to prioritize what's important - having a nice place, or having nice things. It can be hard to do both. Maybe find other hobbies that are not as expensive. I have about $10k in musical gear, but that stuff lasts a lifetime and has a one time cost.

[Apoc]

Would agree on the mortgage stuff. It's the best debt to carry, especially if you have other high interest debt that cannot be deducted on your taxes. I have absolutely zero desire to pay my house off early, especially since I can make more than my mortgage interest rate in the market. As in, I'd actually be losing money if I paid into my principal more than required.

I don't think certifications are going to buy you much... but I've never been in a field that required them. It seems more likely your upward mobility is limited by job opportunities (and maybe your degree) - you're just not going to make as much in H'burg as a major metropolitan city. Cost of living is higher in those places and does offset it, but there are usually options for cheaper living (assuming you aren't hellbent on owning a house). I just don't perceive you have enough years post college to be able to afford both a house and expensive hobbies.

Cars have to be one of the most expensive hobbies that isn't boats or planes. It can be difficult to not do things that make you happy, but it seems like you're already not happy by not doing them because you can't afford it. I'd suggest figuring out what you really like about the scene and see if you can't find that somewhere that's far less expensive.

[Tyler.M]

All good points. To Ryan's point, a cheap car would probably get me there. I also did just get myself a nice motorcycle but it's not really something I would track, more a touring bike. I'm in between trying to get something to auto-x or a a trackbike but there's just more events for car stuff around the Burg. I also really enjoy this community and want to participate in some form or another. A cheap miata would probably do the trick, but then I get into the "but I could afford xyz if I really pushed my budget" and start down that path. Then I'm justifying a 20k car purchase for funsies when my daily just hit 186k and I'll probably need to replace it in two to three years (4Runner gang). Ultimately, it's a discipline problem which was sort of what I was referencing at the start of my little thread here; my mental health directly impacts my budgetary focus. I'm impatient and tired of always feeling like I don't have enough money to participate in a community that I really enjoy. 

I refinanced to 2.99% and my mortgage is now 800 a month for a little more than a half acre, an attached garage and 1600sq feet right in the shadow of the JMU stadium. I have 80k of positive equity in the place now (just hit 8 years of ownership) and most of the major home stuff is done, I just want to do bathroom renovations and stuff like that.  Damn you HGTV.

And yeah, I think you guys are right. I have a bunch of expensive hobbies and I need to prioritize. I'm a musician, so that's about 10k of guitars, amps keyboards and stuff. I also build computers, so you know I'm typing on a 2.5-3k custom rig. I ski too, and golf (poorly) and I have a home gym which seems to expand every year. My motorcycle stuff is easily another 12k between my bikes and all my gear/tools. Perhaps my next personal finance goal beyond doing what I'm doing with my income is just take a good inventory of what I got and what I can get rid of.

In terms of relocating, I've been toying with going to Atlanta/ the south for awhile, for a few reasons. I have some really close friends there and the manufacturing market in the south is pretty large. But, the jobs start out or are less than what I make now so it's not as obvious of a good move for me from a career perspective. That's why some sort of additional training seemed like an okay avenue but you're right Apoc, it's not necessary for what I do. I'm just bored with it and want to either move up or move on.  

Credit card debt is finally almost gone. Student loan debt is at 13k and should be gone by March of next year. I'll have 3 months of emergency savings saved up and then I can finally max out my roth contribution, bump up my 401(k) contribution and do some ETF/mutual fund investing.  I'm impatient but just need to grind through the next 10 months or so and see where I'm at.

[Apoc]

Your math suggests you have $25k-30k tied up in hobbies already. I'm in my early 40s and I probably have <$10k. It's a personal choice for everyone, but that might be a place to ask honest questions about whether you're getting the fulfillment you want out of them.

FWIW, I took a pay cut to relocate out of nova and join Amazon. It stung, but I caught up and exceeded my previous earnings within ~3 years. YMMV.

[Senor_Taylor]

Your math suggests you have $25k-30k tied up in hobbies already. I'm in my early 40s and I probably have <$10k. It's a personal choice for everyone, but that might be a place to ask honest questions about whether you're getting the fulfillment you want out of them.

FWIW, I took a pay cut to relocate out of nova and join Amazon. It stung, but I caught up and exceeded my previous earnings within ~3 years. YMMV.

Your Porsche is <10k?

Is Travel not a hobby?

[Apoc]

Your math suggests you have $25k-30k tied up in hobbies already. I'm in my early 40s and I probably have <$10k. It's a personal choice for everyone, but that might be a place to ask honest questions about whether you're getting the fulfillment you want out of them.

FWIW, I took a pay cut to relocate out of nova and join Amazon. It stung, but I caught up and exceeded my previous earnings within ~3 years. YMMV.

Your Porsche is <10k?

Is Travel not a hobby?

Maybe I'm off base here, but I don't consider a collector car that is occasionally driven on the street and is worth 3x what I paid for it ($15.8k) as a hobby. In my mind, it's an investment that has upside - like a house. If I was tracking it and paying for consumables, then my opinion would be different. That's probably an unpopular perspective in a motorsports group. Even if I did count it, I'm still at about the same level as Tyler with 3x the income.

Travel is pretty much the only hobby I have. The difference with it is it's an experience over an asset, so it's hard to compare. I pay money from my budgeted disposable income, I have an experience, and then do the next thing when budget allows. I'm not sitting on 10s of $K of assets that sit in my house unused 99% of the time. My point was if he wants a track car to prioritize those physical assets based on what brings the most pleasure. I didn't want to sell my Ducati, but I realized that money would make me happier elsewhere. 

If it matters, we spend ~6% of our household income on travel annually. That's probably less than most spend here on their hobbies.... even if you account for the freedom of what 20 years of salary growth affords us. Our level of spending isn't any more right than anyone else's; I provide it for reference. People need to make the choice based on what's important to them.

[Senor_Taylor]

Your math suggests you have $25k-30k tied up in hobbies already. I'm in my early 40s and I probably have <$10k. It's a personal choice for everyone, but that might be a place to ask honest questions about whether you're getting the fulfillment you want out of them.

FWIW, I took a pay cut to relocate out of nova and join Amazon. It stung, but I caught up and exceeded my previous earnings within ~3 years. YMMV.

Your Porsche is <10k?

Is Travel not a hobby?

Maybe I'm off base here, but I don't consider a collector car that is occasionally driven on the street and is worth 3x what I paid for it ($15.8k) as a hobby. In my mind, it's an investment that has upside - like a house. If I was tracking it and paying for consumables, then my opinion would be different. That's probably an unpopular perspective in a motorsports group. Even if I did count it, I'm still at about the same level as Tyler with 3x the income.

Travel is pretty much the only hobby I have. The difference with it is it's an experience over an asset, so it's hard to compare. I pay money from my budgeted disposable income, I have an experience, and then do the next thing when budget allows. I'm not sitting on 10s of $K of assets that sit in my house unused 99% of the time. My point was if he wants a track car to prioritize those physical assets based on what brings the most pleasure. I didn't want to sell my Ducati, but I realized that money would make me happier elsewhere. 

If it matters, we spend ~6% of our household income on travel annually. That's probably less than most spend here on their hobbies.... even if you account for the freedom of what 20 years of salary growth affords us. Our level of spending isn't any more right than anyone else's; I provide it for reference. People need to make the choice based on what's important to them.

Yeah, not trying to give you a hard time, it just didn't seem like an accurate comparison. In the same vein of your porsche being an investment, the travel is just throwing money away from a financial perspective. There's no asset.

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[Apoc]

travel is just throwing money away from a financial perspective. There's no asset.

Gas, tires, parts, entry fees, etc. are all "just throwing money away from a financial perspective." We all pay money for pleasure - the pleasure is the only asset that matters... unless we want to brag that we own things or it's an investment. All I'm saying is look at ALL cash outlays and ask if that cash outlay is providing you the pleasure you want or if that could be used elsewhere (e.g. sell musical instruments and buy a car). To me, it seemed like he had a lot of money tied up in comparison to his income and it was more about "how can I afford this too?" when he's already doing really well for himself.

[Tyler.M]

Yeah, good point. I mean, I think I'll be pretty shocked with how much I spend on frivolous stuff once I add up all of the equipment and such I have laying around for projects/hobbies I never saw through to completion. Hell, I have basically a home studio setup and kinda lost steam on it.... and then kept all of my studio monitors in a glorified PC media setup. Woops. I research a lot and buy well but then I lose steam and get bored and don't sell anything. I can literally talk your ear off about almost anything since I've probably dabbled in it. I just don't do a good job at fully exiting a hobby. I think that's my next step. I'm going to free up some funds by reducing my island of misfit hobbies and go from there. Thanks for the pointers, gents. Appreciate you guys.

[D_Eclipse9916]

Yeah, good point. I mean, I think I'll be pretty shocked with how much I spend on frivolous stuff once I add up all of the equipment and such I have laying around for projects/hobbies I never saw through to completion. Hell, I have basically a home studio setup and kinda lost steam on it.... and then kept all of my studio monitors in a glorified PC media setup. Woops. I research a lot and buy well but then I lose steam and get bored and don't sell anything. I can literally talk your ear off about almost anything since I've probably dabbled in it. I just don't do a good job at fully exiting a hobby. I think that's my next step. I'm going to free up some funds by reducing my island of misfit hobbies and go from there. Thanks for the pointers, gents. Appreciate you guys.

I have a lot of hobbies too. Winding down on my largest one and realizing just how much stuff I have for it is ridiculous. My hobby “paid back” with the good fortune of doing very well and being a go to guy; but time is something you can’t ever be paid back. I think the hobby ended up owning me; curious to see if I will truly miss it as much as I think I might.

[Senor_Taylor]

Yeah, good point. I mean, I think I'll be pretty shocked with how much I spend on frivolous stuff once I add up all of the equipment and such I have laying around for projects/hobbies I never saw through to completion. Hell, I have basically a home studio setup and kinda lost steam on it.... and then kept all of my studio monitors in a glorified PC media setup. Woops. I research a lot and buy well but then I lose steam and get bored and don't sell anything. I can literally talk your ear off about almost anything since I've probably dabbled in it. I just don't do a good job at fully exiting a hobby. I think that's my next step.  I'm going to free up some funds by reducing my island of misfit hobbies and go from there. Thanks for the pointers, gents. Appreciate you guys.

I have a lot of hobbies too. Winding down on my largest one and realizing just how much stuff I have for it is ridiculous.  My hobby “paid back” with the good fortune of doing very well and being a go to guy; but time is something you can’t ever be paid back. I think the hobby ended up owning me; curious to see if I will truly miss it as much as I think I might.

Being "that guy" is rewarding but draining. I often think about the debacle years ago where you mentioned people chipping in for garage supplies when you lend them a hand and they use your stuff and continue to agree with it.

[Jake]

Yeah, good point. I mean, I think I'll be pretty shocked with how much I spend on frivolous stuff once I add up all of the equipment and such I have laying around for projects/hobbies I never saw through to completion. Hell, I have basically a home studio setup and kinda lost steam on it.... and then kept all of my studio monitors in a glorified PC media setup. Woops. I research a lot and buy well but then I lose steam and get bored and don't sell anything. I can literally talk your ear off about almost anything since I've probably dabbled in it. I just don't do a good job at fully exiting a hobby. I think that's my next step.  I'm going to free up some funds by reducing my island of misfit hobbies and go from there. Thanks for the pointers, gents. Appreciate you guys.

Hey Tyler, I'm a little late to the party here but you asked earlier up "how do you all afford track cars" etc etc. so here's how I did it with a good bit of transparency.

The biggest hurdle to acknowledge is that I never had student loans. Those can be a sizable payment each month so good on you for getting yours knocked down. Beyond that, I largely made it through the last nine (fuck) years since graduation with a lot of luck, some hustling, and not a lot of savings until very recently. I'd say I floated by with a few grand in savings for most of that time and only got serious in the last year or two. It was dumb but it let me get on track early and there is a lot of value in enjoying your life and friends and hobbies while you are young and fit and full of energy/stamina. Wouldn't trade it for the world.

My thought was that I lived in an area with a lot of jobs in my field (web development, technology consulting, etc) and if I were to be let go for some reason, I could find work easily enough. It was a risk but not the biggest one at the time. In today's climate I'd probably think differently as Ryan mentioned.

When my Miata engine blew up and I was daily-driving what is now Taylor's Spec3 BMW, I sold the BMW for a new Focus ST. It felt right at the time as I was worried about DDing an old BMW when my second car was blown up. Hindsight is 20/20 and maybe that E36 would have continued to be a reliable commuter. In any case, I did a lot of side work to build up down payment money on the Focus. Sold it a year later because I didn't like it enough and lost my ass on depreciation. Should have either kept the E36 or bought my dad's Infiniti from him when he sold it. Would have been a well-kept, nice, boring commuter for like $4k cash. I then sold the Focus for a 128i which was awesome but should have been a truck/SUV to tow with instead. After the 128i, I financed my '05 Yukon Denali which needed parts thrown at it on a monthly basis. Didn't learn my lesson that financing a fairly old, high mileage vehicle is a dumb idea when you're also paying to fix it.

I bought a Pontiac Firebird for $400 and flipped it for $2400 when I lived with DJ. That paid for my open trailer. I sold the open trailer a handful of years later for $2k and bought my enclosed for a pretty good deal at oh... $7800? Maybe a hair less. I put cash down and financed 2/3s of it through LightStream, which will do higher-interest loans for trailers, RVs, ATVs, and so on. I think the interest rate was about 7% so not great but not bad given that purchase let me move to a more desirable area as it's a rolling garage.

Building the E36 M3 racecar was a struggle given I was trying to do a lot with not a lot of income. I bought that car when I was making something like $48k/year living in NoVA and going out to bars four nights a week. Ended up running up a big credit card bill in like 2015 and used my first-job 401k cashout to pay it off. It was so painful pulling that money out and paying the penalties, but CC interest was killing me and finding $8k cash to just end it all was what I had to do. No real CC debt to speak of since then, I pay every card in full every time I get paid. I do have a few cards I use for various things to capitalize on rewards points/programs.

I think my biggest regret through all of this has been the points where I had two car loans at the same time. My 2011 F-150 and 2006 M3 were financed in tandem and I hated having two payments, particularly for such an old BMW that also had the risk of blowing up about nine different and creative ways, perhaps all at once. I could've just had the truck and had more money for savings + racecar.

The second-biggest regret was getting my new/current job and immediately leasing a new $65k-MSRP F-150. This was a key example of "just because you can afford it doesn't mean you should buy it" and my payment plus insurance each month was eye-wateringly close to having a comma in it. Really. Ford bought the truck back due to something they couldn't fix on the 5.0L V8 and turning those keys in was a huge relief. It allowed me to pick up my CPO, very nice Ram and sock away half of the Ford payment to savings each month. 

I have a loan on my Ram 1500 but I have a lot of positive equity in it, and I've had fun dicking around with street cars that I buy in cash, do something goofy with, and sell a few months later. I have a near-300k-mile Volvo right now with three pedals and a turbocharger. It's more fun than something newer because I just don't give any fucks about it.

I'm at the point now where my only debt is my pickup truck, I save a fairly good amount in cash each month, contribute to my 401k, and invest on my own. It's all pretty good now but has not been like this in the past. I still have side gigs that keep me very busy but they allow for a lot of perks, too. Hoping to build Out Motorsports up to be a form of passive income in ad revenue (one day, sigh) but that will be a long way off.

[Tyler.M]

Shew, that's a lot Jake. It puts things into perspective though, I always wondered how you guys in NOVA had so much cool stuff coming out of undergrad. I was sitting here with a house and a beat up XJ going, I WANT THAT TOO. So, I bought an FRS I couldn't afford and tried to keep up with Jones (even though those Jones were 2 hours away). 

 See, I bought a house when I was 22 and still in college and while I always had housemates helping with the mortgage, maintenance had been a large suck on my finances. I think I discount how much of a drain it is because everything I've repaired has been a necessity.  I probably could have had some cooler cars through my 20's if I didn't buy my house, but overall my positive equity in my home has been better overall for my financial health then probably having a revolving door of vehicles. It's just more boring. I'm not a do it yourselfer, I don't really care about lawn maintenance. It was just a good investment at the time with 0 real excitement behind it.   

I can kind of trace some of my hesitation on getting a fast, fun car again back to my GTO experience and just how much of an absolute shit show that was for me (mostly caused by my ignorance). My motor blew up from a known issue on the LS2, the third party warranty company claimed it was my fault and denied my claim AFTER THE MOTOR WAS APART AT THE DEALERSHIP. Picking up a car in pieces, after getting shafted by a shady company and being able to do nothing about it is a sobering experience.  For basically 2 years, I paid monthly payments on a car with no motor in it, in my driveway AND THEN had to pay someone to rebuild the motor, drop it in with the help of a local mechanic and try to sell it just to get myself out the money pit. I basically had the entire value of the car in maintenance and repairs billed to a credit card at like 12% interest, plus the car payment itself. Absolutely brutal and the biggest drain on my finances in the last 8 years. I wish I could justify getting a cool s2000, e46 M3, or an M5 or an older Porsche or something, but after that experience, I kinda figured I'd need a lot more cash or get something pretty damn nice and CPO'd to be willing to get back into car stuff again. But, the first rule of racing is don't track what you can't afford to crash so even if I did get something nice, I'd be hard-parking for days and it wouldn't serve the purpose for why it was built. 

Now though, I think I'll get something more track/autox oriented (car or bike, I'm not sure) next year and try to pay cash for it, and it'll be cheap. Like under 5k cheap. You can get a well prepped track bike for like 3k and I already have a trailer which makes it easy. I'll maybe siphon off a small percentage of income to do fund my motorsports stuff after I hit my other goals closer to the end of this year and create a "fun account" so I can keep my budget a little bit exciting. Strict personal finance always feels like this funeral dirge to retirement and I need a little bit of space in the budget to do some fun stuff.  I'm struggling with how much to allocate to that but it sound like to participate in motorsports in any real racing sort of way, it would be a huge drain. I'm not going to do that. I just want to learn to drive better and have a space to make mistakes. I'll take another look once I get out of my student loans. 

This conversation has been good in kind of figuring out how you guys have managed to do this stuff, but bottom line is that I'm generally more risk-averse financially and that's sort of what has been my biggest mental road-block. And, I have a home and have had one for the majority of my "wealth building" early years.  I should also probably get treatment for adhd   . Thanks for the feedback, everyone.