vehicle recommendations?

[stevegula]

My 12mpg is beyond affordable with gas prices and I don't think they're going to get any less. So I'm hoping you car fiends can help me out. I'm looking for something that can tow 2 motorcycles + light aluminum trailer (so ~1500lb or ~3500lb tow rating) and averages around 20mpg if not more in the city. My 4.7L Dakota is averaging ~12.5mpg. If I really really nurse it I can squeeze out 13.

Anyone have any thoughts? I looked at some of the mini-SUV hybrids but the Ford (and rebadged others) top out at 1000lb towing and I hear the Saturn Vue Hybrid is a total POS. I haven't ruled out a four banger pickup yet either.

So - requirements:
Cost less than $20k (and the less the better, I have a $350/mo car payment, I don't want it going up)
~20mpg in the city
1500lb or higher towing capacity.

Cars are utility to me, so looks are almost entirely moot. And if necessary I'm probably willing to trade in my manhood for a vag because I am pretty sure there isn't a manly vehicle around that meets these requirements.

[.RJ]

Subaru Forester
Ford Escape
4 cyl Tacoma

[WRXtranceformed]

Any Toyota 4 or 6 cylinder should do it, although my Yota 4 bangers I dont think ever saw more than 18 or 19mpg... probably because they were so old that I just beat on them.

[.RJ]

The new 4 cyl tacos should get MPG in the 20/27 range (unloaded).

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I'm thinking about buying one... but I really want the 4.0L 6 cyl.

[WRXtranceformed]

My V6 Tundra actually I think got close to 20mpg if I was easy on it... it also usually averaged about 18.5. You can pick those up on the cheap too.

[HAULN-SS]

Jeep Liberty diesel?

[ScottyB]

it may not be what you're after but our 4.0L explorer managed a 24 mpg tank loaded up while travelling on the interstate. not sure on the tow rating i imagine its not bad.

just watch the automatic tranny on them....

[.RJ]

Jeep Liberty diesel?

Diesel is quite a bit more expensive than gas right now...

Another thing to consider is will you be able to sell the truck? I have had no luck at all moving my F150, even trying to sell it $1k under KBB

Carrying a 2nd car/insurance payment on anything (even a $1000 beater) eats into whatever gas savings you realize over the truck.

[stevegula]

I'm not remotely worried about interstate driving. I'd say it makes up for ~10% of my driving, tops. Traffic light driving is where I spend nearly all of my time.

[ViPER1313]

it may not be what you're after but our 4.0L explorer managed a 24 mpg tank loaded up while travelling on the interstate. not sure on the tow rating i imagine its not bad.

just watch the automatic tranny on them....

Thats a lot higher than I have ever seen on my fathers Mountaineer w/ the same motor - it averaged 17.X mpg on a trip to Harrisonburg (empty on the way down, full of stuff on the way back, almost all highway.) It does have full time AWD, but I don't even think the EPA ratings on an Explorer go that high.

Toyota w/ a 4-cyl or a Jeep Liberty Diesel, although I would think a 4-cyl pickup would struggle towing 3500lbs - I know my father's truck does.

[Apoc]

Jeep Liberty diesel?

Diesel is quite a bit more expensive than gas right now...

Another thing to consider is will you be able to sell the truck? I have had no luck at all moving my F150, even trying to sell it $1k under KBB

I just read this article today...

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...the resale of big things is plummeting.

Guy I work with has diesel Liberty for towing his boat. He gets ~23 in traffic but is thinking of selling it because of the cost of diesel. He hasn't really come up with a viable solution that'll still tow I'm not sure there's much else out there besides a Forrester or 4-banger.

[BLINGMW]

Guy I work with has diesel Liberty for towing his boat. He gets ~23 in traffic but is thinking of selling it because of the cost of diesel.

yeah, I don't really think he's thought that through. What's he going to get instead? A gas truck/van that gets at best 20MPG, even less in "traffic", and come out behind on fuel costs? Good plan.

I 2nd the diesel Liberty. For a cheaper option, the Mazda MPV ('98 and previous) was rated to tow 4000 lbs with the tow package, which included trans cooler and load leveling rear suspension.

[ViPER1313]

I would really consider picking up a cheap beater Civic / Corolla / CRX / Geo Metro to use as a daily - keep the pickup (being an 03 is it close to being / is paid off?) That way you can tow something if need be but get sweet MPGs in the meantime. Or sell the pickup, go buy a Yaris and an early 90's SUV / Pickup if you want to make the DD the drop dead reliable car of the bunch.

[Ginger]

You start to nix fuel savings when you add a second insurance payment, second set of repairs, second PPTs, etc. Without a truck I'm saving over $50 a month in insurance alone (nevermind the $50-$60 a tank).

Why aren't you commuting on a bike, Steve? This is a legit question, not just one to harp on "commuting/year round superiority." I'm seeing 57-65mpg on my supermoto and the worst I see, year round, is when I take my big, heavy BMW, which gets ~35mpg. And... it's fun. On days when you don't want to ride (or can't, like snow), it's tolerable to spare the gas on the truck.

Other than that, my V6 T100 got 17mpg all city. The 4 cylinder Taco should a lot more better mileage (especially if you go 2wd, stripper model - you know, a painter's truck). When I was thinkiing of a daily to haul a bike, the Baja came to mind - it wouldn't be terribly hard to get something to get the extra few inches necessary out of the bed to put a bike in.

[Sijray21]

So - requirements:
Cost less than $20k (and the less the better, I have a $350/mo car payment, I don't want it going up)
~20mpg in the city
1500lb or higher towing capacity.

oddly enough...

The 2008 or older Hyundai Elantra:
1500lbs capacity without trailer brakes and 3000 with trailer brakes! hock: (edit: trying to find more than one internet source for this one - only source = <!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.edmunds.com/reviews/list/top10/102426/article.html">http://www.edmunds.com/reviews/list/top ... ticle.html</a><!-- m -->)

25 city/33 hwy

brand new they're closer to $15k-$17k and used they're even cheaper.

i know you said that cars are really a utility, so i'm testing that theory

[ViPER1313]

On a ranting note, I don't know why people are freaking so much about the price of gas (other than the fact that the media has nothing better to report on.) The Pontiac only averages ~21mpg in my commute (past 800 miles has been 21.6mpg), uses premium, and I have a 60-mile daily commute - would still drive it over a Yaris or Civic. I doubt most people drive more than 1k miles a month. So lets figure it out.

1000/13mpg = Approx 77gal / gas per month @ $4 gal = $308 a month

A car that would get 26mpg (double your current MPGs) net you a savings of $154 a month. In the grand scheme of things, $5 a day really isn't that much.

Now figure that the pickup truck you own is close to being paid off (maybe 1 year, maybe 2.) Selling the truck now, with gas prices and the market the way they are, you are probably going to get 2->3g under what the truck is worth. You also have to look forward to the truck being paid off - gas would have to go up over $9 a gallon to counteract the money you would save from not having a car payment.

Just another way of looking at it...

[Sijray21]

1000/13mpg = Approx 77gal / gas per month @ $4 gal = $308 a month

A car that would get 26mpg (double your current MPGs) net you a savings of $154 a month. In the grand scheme of things, $5 a day really isn't that much.

but it's 1/2 the cost in gas per month...50% less gas burned and 50% more $ i your pocket. what's not to like about that?

i say get a commuter bike (55-60 mpg) :wink:

[NTIman]

I recommend against a new body style (05-current) Tacoma with the 2.7 4 banger.

It simply blows power wise, I guess they put a fuel mileage gear in it, and I don't think you'd be too happy with its acceleration.

Have you checked out the specs on a hybrid highlander? They're pretty solid, and the old body style seems more powerful than a regular highlander.

[Dave]

Wow, 13mpg is pathetic for a small truck. I get 16 in the 7.3L F-250 :-). Of course, that is virtually all highway miles, but it's a goddamn tank, I've only seen it drop down to 13 when having to deal with more city driving than usual and towing a car at the same time!

As for everybody beating down on the false economies of a 2nd vehicle... My case may be unusual, but I am saving a lot of money by buying a cheap and efficient beater. My fuel costs have cut in half (75 miles a day), my insurance went up marginally, and my maintenance costs are the same if not cheaper.

Seeing as how dumping the truck would be hard at this time b/c nobody wants to buy b/c of the speculation on fuel costs, I will put in a vote for finding a cheap bike to DD, or a small fuel efficient car.

[Jeff]

I drove a little Ranger this past week and it did bangin for fuel economy. It was an I-4 w/automatic. Slow as hell...but if it could pull a trailer it might be a choice...5-speed would be a must.