Need a new track car....

[.RJ]

I think that what its going to come down to is a Miata or a Hatchcrapper with a B16 or B18 (vtec of course ) motor. I need something lighter and cheaper to own as well as easier to replace when I hit a large, immobile object - I cant justify the car/insurance payment on the ITR ($400/mo on both) to track it another year and if I put another 13k miles on it like I did last year the resale value will take a huge hit. I have cash to pay for something else, and being out of the car payment will be nice, so I can buy a truck down the road. Ideally I'd like to have less than $8k wrapped up in the track car just to do DE's with.

What do you guys think - I may be looking at the red miata this weekend, its < 2 hrs away from me.

Pros on both of them:

- Can use 15" tires (I have 12 good 205/50/15 r-tires sitting in my garage)
- Familiar with both cars
- Reasonably cheap to own/operate
- OPM Autosports is nearby if I need anything

Pros on the miata:

Example: <!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.specmiata.com/Classifieds/detail.php?siteid=2016">http://www.specmiata.com/Classifieds/de ... iteid=2016</a><!-- m --> ~$6k

- Can go to SM with a relatively small investment in $$ and time
- Resale values strong, especially for a built SM racer
- RWD
- Blast to drive
- Open top for the summertime, if I can tolerate the spec suspension on the street
- Stock LSD
- Easy on equipment
- Easily boosted, to feed my p-car rolling ego with (although more $$ but I could sell all my ITR parts to fund that)

Cons on the Miata

- No storage space, need a tire trailer
- Small inside
- Cant use my Evo2's, and custom mounting an Evo isnt cheap
- Somewhat slow, unless boosted

Pros on the Cibbic

Example: <!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=1103222">http://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=1103222</a><!-- m --> ~$5k

- I have a bunch of parts already (wheels, brake pads, revalved konis some spares)
- I like Hondas
- Vtec power to feed my p-car rolling ego with
- Lighter than a Miata
- Can use my Evo2's and probably my rollbar
- Can race ECHC H4/H5 with a d-series motor

Cons on the Cibbic

- FWD
- Theft magnet
- Will need to install a LSD
- Resale on IT/ECHC cars sucks real bad and much more expensive to prep
- Harder on tires/brakes
- Usual assortment of busted shit found on any 10+ y/o honda (like my 91 integra fiasco)
- Go-fast parts more expensive than a Miata (LSD and Final Drive would eat up $1200 of budget)

[Sijray21]

i say civic just for the flexibility, interchangeable parts, and you know a lot about fixing them anyway. Not to mention that its slightly cheaper.

[KPWSerpiente]

Miata, RWD, plus a stronger engine.

-T

[white_2kgt]

Oh lord, are you being for real??

--chad

[.RJ]

Oh lord, are you being for real??

Whats your point?

I'm sure as hell not buying a heavy ass, hell on tires and brakes no handling stick axle shitbox

[BLINGMW]

I'm sure as hell not buying a heavy ass, hell on tires and brakes no handling stick axle shitbox

wheeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee :lol:

RWD > FWD. Miata. And good point on OPM, they'd hook it UP!

[Dave]

FD isn't an option???? BOOOOOOO

Are you really considering racing, or just putting that in as another option? You might want to be clearer on your ultimate goals before deciding which to buy. Furthermore, you can always buy one, then when you get serious, sell and buy the other.

[.RJ]

Are you really considering racing

In the future yes, but not this year.

[JohnC]

Miata - RWD

Thats my vote. And if you need to get rid of the Evo 2's, I'll take 'em.

[white_2kgt]

Oh lord, are you being for real??

Whats your point?

I'm sure as hell not buying a heavy ass, hell on tires and brakes no handling stick axle shitbox

It's called a challenge, plus you can have the option of being in one of the fastest NASA race classes in the future . You've got a good job, suck it up and get something fast :!:

--chad

[.RJ]

Too bad most of teh ECHC H1 field rolled AI and AIX at VIR last year

[white_2kgt]

VIR Sunday, August 1, 2004

Code:

1 AIX Championship P. Johns  1989 Pontiac Trans Am  01:40.585 12 Lap 12
2 GTSU A. Watts Winston-Salem 1995  M3  01:36.673 12 00:03:617
3 AI Championship B. Shugg Charlotte 1998  Mustang Cobra  01:42.412 12 00:06:772
4 Factory Five Challenge B. Cates Broad Run 65  ffr cobra  01:40.792 12 00:07:429
5 Factory Five Challenge B. Dobyns Manassas 65  spec racer  01:41.118 12 00:07:787
6 HC 1 Championship S. Burner Camp Hill 2001  S2000  01:42.486 12 00:14:221

Hum, nope not that one,
<!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.nasaracing.net/04jul30/results/HC1-Big%20Bore%20Race%20Sunday.html">http://www.nasaracing.net/04jul30/resul ... unday.html</a><!-- m -->

Let's try,
Summit Point Sunday, November 7, 2004

Code:

1 FFR B. Dobyns Manassas, VA Spec Racer 01:23.778 14 Lap 14
2 FFR B. Cates  Cobra 01:23.489 14 00:03:528
3 VVC F. Barba  Viper 01:21.077 14 00:05:654
4 AI Championship B. Dunnivant Blountville, TN Mustang 01:24.312 14 00:12:095
5 AI Championship B. Shugg  Mustang 01:24.290 14 00:12:542
6 FFR B. Cunningham  Cobra 01:23.303 14 00:19:459
7 AI Championship B. Smith Richmond, VA Mustang 01:24.502 14 00:21:007
8 AI Championship R. Kaser Island Park, NY Mustang 01:25.195 14 00:21:468
9 HC1 J. Evans  CRX 01:25.513 14 00:23:991

Nope, not there either. An that was 4 AI cars not even AIX that beat the H1 car!
<!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.nasaracing.net/2004results.htm">http://www.nasaracing.net/2004results.htm</a><!-- m -->

--chad

[.RJ]

VIR Sunday, August 1, 2004

Hum, nope not that one,
<!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.nasaracing.net/04jul30/results/HC1-Big%20Bore%20Race%20Sunday.html">http://www.nasaracing.net/04jul30/resul ... unday.html</a><!-- m -->

Heh.... look past the top 5 spots fool

1 1 72 AIX Championship P. Johns 1989 Pontiac Trans Am 01:40.585 12 Lap 12
2 1 19 GTSU A. Watts Winston-Salem 1995 M3 01:36.673 12 00:03:617
3 1 67 AI Championship B. Shugg Charlotte 1998 Mustang Cobra 01:42.412 12 00:06:772
4 1 27 Factory Five Challenge B. Cates Broad Run 65 ffr cobra 01:40.792 12 00:07:429
5 2 77 Factory Five Challenge B. Dobyns Manassas 65 spec racer 01:41.118 12 00:07:787
6 1 30 HC 1 Championship S. Burner Camp Hill 2001 S2000 01:42.486 12 00:14:221
7 2 188 HC 1 Championship J. Whitaker E. Windsor 1992 Civic cxR 01:43.004 12 00:18:782
8 3 15 HC 1 Championship J. Evans 01:43.031 12 00:22:091
9 2 90 GTSU R. Mason Columbus 1995 M3 01:37.937 12 00:23:105
10 2 75 AIX Championship S. Whitson Hickory 1995 Cobra Mustang 01:44.166 12 00:36:550
11 1 128 Super Unlimited/B M. Jones Chevy Chase 97 Monte Carlo 01:40.240 12 00:37:900
12 3 20 Factory Five Challenge R. Mau Montpelier 1966 FFR Spec Cobra 01:43.958 12 00:37:951
13 4 20 HC 1 Championship C. Jacobs Honda Prelude 01:42.754 12 00:41:606
14 2 69 AI Championship B. Smith Mustang 01:43.783 12 00:44:643
15 5 33 HC 1 Championship M. Bookler King of Prussia 1993 Civic Hybrid 01:45.424 12 00:56:045
16 4 11 Factory Five Challenge T. Lawson Brothers Racing #2 Sunnyvale 65 Cobra 01:45.602 12 00:56:595
17 3 68 AI Championship B. Dunnivant Blountville 1992 Mustang 01:45.316 12 00:58:637
18 6 62 HC 1 Championship C. Drabouski Collegeville 97 Civic 01:45.252 12 00:59:110
19 7 94 HC 1 Championship P. Ambrose Mechanicsville 92 Civic HB 01:44.003 12 01:03:547
20 8 96 HC 1 Championship P. Whitt Greensboro 1995 Civic CX Hatchback 01:46.481 12 01:10:122

[Mike]

rwd > fwd
hatch > small 2 seater
vtec > notec
faster > slower
civic image (ricer) = miata image (homosexual)

i'd give the civic the slight favor, but i'm pretty damn biased. i forget who i was talking to recently, but we agreed that it is INCREDIBLY difficult to take a miata seriously. oh, it was derecola...

[damnit458]

Im gonna hafta say miata. as much as I want a hatchback, I wouldnt pass up RWD.

[G.Irish]

Depends on how much the inconvenience of a Miata would bother you. Also, you won't win the time trial without turbo on the Miata, not to mention you'd be competing with some other big bad machinery. With the Civic if you could beat Andy Hope you're golden.

On the resale value though I think the Miata's a great bet. You'll also probably end up spending a lot less on parts as a whole. I still say you should go turbo though.

[G.Irish]

[quote="white_2kgt"]VIR Sunday, August 1, 2004

Code:

1 AIX Championship P. Johns  1989 Pontiac Trans Am  01:40.585 12 Lap 12
2 GTSU A. Watts Winston-Salem 1995  M3  01:36.673 12 00:03:617
3 AI Championship B. Shugg Charlotte 1998  Mustang Cobra  01:42.412 12 00:06:772
4 Factory Five Challenge B. Cates Broad Run 65  ffr cobra  01:40.792 12 00:07:429
5 Factory Five Challenge B. Dobyns Manassas 65  spec racer  01:41.118 12 00:07:787
6 HC 1 Championship S. Burner Camp Hill 2001  S2000  01:42.486 12 00:14:221

Hum, nope not that one,
<!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.nasaracing.net/04jul30/results/HC1-Big%20Bore%20Race%20Sunday.html">http://www.nasaracing.net/04jul30/resul ... unday.html</a><!-- m -->

Let's try,
Summit Point Sunday, November 7, 2004

Code:

1 FFR B. Dobyns Manassas, VA Spec Racer 01:23.778 14 Lap 14
2 FFR B. Cates  Cobra 01:23.489 14 00:03:528
3 VVC F. Barba  Viper 01:21.077 14 00:05:654
4 AI Championship B. Dunnivant Blountville, TN Mustang 01:24.312 14 00:12:095
5 AI Championship B. Shugg  Mustang 01:24.290 14 00:12:542
6 FFR B. Cunningham  Cobra 01:23.303 14 00:19:459
7 AI Championship B. Smith Richmond, VA Mustang 01:24.502 14 00:21:007
8 AI Championship R. Kaser Island Park, NY Mustang 01:25.195 14 00:21:468
9 HC1 J. Evans  CRX 01:25.513 14 00:23:991

Nope, not there either. An that was 4 AI cars not even AIX that beat the H1 car!
<!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.nasaracing.net/2004results.htm">http://www.nasaracing.net/2004results.htm</a><!-- m -->

How convenient that you left out Saturday's results.

1 03 FFR B. Cates Cobra 01:23.688
2 02 FFR B. Cunningham Cobra 01:23.644
3 30 HC1 S. Burner S2000 01:23.658
4 77 FFR B. Dobyns Spec Racer 01:23.288
5 42 HC1 P. Curpier Civic HX 01:24.110
6 68 AI B. Dunnivant Mustang 01:24.094
7 69 AI B. Smith Mustang 01:24.468
8 90 AI R. Kaser Mustang 01:24.492
9 67 AI B. Shugg Mustang 01:24.065
10 05 HC1 K. Helms Civic 01:26.057

All HC vs AI grandstaning aside though, I think ultimately when the drivers/equipment gets better, I think AI will end up being faster than H1. There are a few cars in H1 that haven't been build yet that could change that though. I'm also curious to see how much speed is left in the front running H1 and AI cars at this point. Probably a good amount I'd imagine.

As it stands right now neither class is signficantly faster than the other. AIX naturally would be but in a class like that a lot of stuff breaks so turnout isn't consistent.

[white_2kgt]

VIR Sunday, August 1, 2004

Hum, nope not that one,
<!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.nasaracing.net/04jul30/results/HC1-Big%20Bore%20Race%20Sunday.html">http://www.nasaracing.net/04jul30/resul ... unday.html</a><!-- m -->

Heh.... look past the top 5 spots fool

uh, ok I could also actually look up H4-5 times and go right to the bottom since that's probably where you will be running anyway. :lol:

--chad

[.RJ]

I still say you should go turbo though.

Used JRSC w/ mo' boost pulley and intercooler will be fine for now - turbo possibly later, but if I want more power its not going to be cheap (clutch, engine mangagment, cost of turbo parts, etc).

[ScottyB]

it is INCREDIBLY difficult to take a miata seriously...

just another thing i love about miatas. nobody respects them/takes them seriously.

i would love to watch someone's ego get decimated as i pass them in a mee-otter! maybe i'd throw in a limp-wristed wave, too.