Electile Dysfunction (Current students plz look!)

[JPolen01]

I do think we need a comprehensive immigration reform package.

Nailed it.

[HAULN-SS]

I don't mind the idea of a toll so much on a road i use regularly, as long as it actually improves the road. The fund should not become a general slush fund, svrf if the fund is full the tolls should be disabled until the next improvements are needed. I don't want to see a permanent road tax put in place

[CaptainHenreh]

Rexy it still doesnt explain where the money went (1987 until now)... up this way, they use the exact same patching used in Turkey... cheapest stuff possible.

I mean, most of the money got spent "keeping it up", not expanding or rerouting. There have been improvements along I81, just not enough.

[D_Eclipse9916]

Stupid. Let's invest in millions of dollars of "toll infastructure" instead of through low cost fees. The problem is all these departments and "funds" are compartmentalized (until they need to "borrow" cash).

Having a trucking registration fee/passenger registration fee built into our current registrations, or through gas tax is a far more effective and less costly way to tax those using roads.

Yay! Let's bill people, but instead of really using that money for improving the roads, we need it to pay for the toll infrastructure that will most likely cost far more than we ever get through tolls; and will inevitability be buoyed by our personal tax dollars. :puke:

[Jake]

I'm with DJ, the cost of setting up a toll process/infrastructure strikes me as costly compared to just goosing the gas tax or something else a little.

[JPolen01]

I'm with DJ, the cost of setting up a toll process/infrastructure strikes me as costly compared to just goosing the gas tax or something else a little.

Yeah but then how could the Chinese owned toll operating companies make any money?

[D_Eclipse9916]

I'm with DJ, the cost of setting up a toll process/infrastructure strikes me as costly compared to just goosing the gas tax or something else a little.

Yeah but then how could the Chinese owned toll operating companies make any money?

^^ I bet there is a little collaboration *Cough* payoff *cough* for this work.

I bet the 2 barriers they are encountering with raising the gas tax or registration fees:
1. Raising fees through the gas tax/registration pisses off everyone vs a lower population pool that thinks somehow this won't cost them.
2. Different buckets, AKA raising the gas tax means everyone gets more money and it'll be wasted some way vs actually being used to hep I-81

[Sijray21]

while i despise tolls, i understand the 'use tax' aspect of it. i don't really see it as the money generated going directly to fund the roads' maintenance, but then again i haven't done the audits or looked them up for the roads i care about. I take tolls as infrequently as possible and that's all i can do as an individual aside from voting/voicing my opinion.

regarding the TROTUS' announcement: ( : sigh : ) i'm so tired of listening to him and seeing his stupid face; i'm not sure why i watched it... i knew where it was going and this whole thing is stupid. after talking with direct family involved with government finance/budget, striking a deal with congress means that the money is assigned from congress specifically for its use. if the TROTUS claims an emergency and decides to use that route the funds will come from the DoD fund, not from the general congressional "budget"; $5.7b is a drop in the bucket for DoD. So this shutdown is nothing but a chest-thumping political nightmare for federal and contract employees who rely on the paycheck to keep their lives running every 2 weeks. Immigration reform needs some improvement, but the $5.7b budget in question is for extremely small section (234 miles) of the 1954-mile long southern border...

[JPolen01]

It doesn't matter how small of a portion of whatever budget $5.7b is. Taxpayers should not be forced to pay for a project that is a) outdated technology b) not requested by anyone in DHS/border patrol c) not wanted by a majority of US citizens.

I assume that if the administration really thought they could declare a state of emergency and pay for the wall out of whatever fund they want they would have done so already. This will be challenged immediately in court so the point will be moot. They know they can't do it so they had to resort to fear-mongering and 'alternative' facts.

Even Fox news called out Sarah Sanders yesterday for her straight up lying about how many 'terrorists' were arrested at the border. She claimed the number was 4,000 when it is really 6 arrests at the border resulting in people ending up on the terror watch list. The rest were arrested at airports. Then you have Kelly Anne Conway claiming it was an 'unfortunate misstatement'. No, that is a lie.

[Ken]

while i despise tolls, i understand the 'use tax' aspect of it. i don't really see it as the money generated going directly to fund the roads' maintenance, but then again i haven't done the audits or looked them up for the roads i care about. I take tolls as infrequently as possible and that's all i can do as an individual aside from voting/voicing my opinion.

regarding the TROTUS' announcement:  ( : sigh : )  i'm so tired of listening to him and seeing his stupid face; i'm not sure why i watched it... i knew where it was going and this whole thing is stupid. after talking with direct family involved with government finance/budget, striking a deal with congress means that the money is assigned from congress specifically for its use. if the TROTUS claims an emergency and decides to use that route the funds will come from the DoD fund, not from the general congressional "budget"; $5.7b is a drop in the bucket for DoD. So this shutdown is nothing but a chest-thumping political nightmare for federal and contract employees who rely on the paycheck to keep their lives running every 2 weeks. Immigration reform needs some improvement, but the $5.7b budget in question is for extremely small section (234 miles) of the 1954-mile long southern border...

I don't think the emergency funding is that straightforward - which is probably the only reason he hasn't done it. Pretty sure Congress can still counteract any declaration, which would force a vote, and it seems that Republican Senators would not be on board with that. Not to mention any legal action that would result.

[Sijray21]

just stating what these tenured government budget officials mentioned (both close to retiring after working with government finance for 25+ years) who, btw, don't like/approve of what Trump is doing.

[Kaan]

I'm with DJ, the cost of setting up a toll process/infrastructure strikes me as costly compared to just goosing the gas tax or something else a little.

Yeah but then how could the Chinese owned toll operating companies make any money?

They are actually from Spain... at least the 495/I66 hotlanes are.

[Sijray21]

I'm with DJ, the cost of setting up a toll process/infrastructure strikes me as costly compared to just goosing the gas tax or something else a little.

Yeah but then how could the Chinese owned toll operating companies make any money?

They are actually from Spain... at least the 495/I66 hotlanes are.

Isn't Transurban Australian? Unless they're owned by some Spanish company.

https://www.transurban.com/roads-and-pro...th-america

[Kaan]

Rexy it still doesnt explain where the money went (1987 until now)... up this way, they use the exact same patching used in Turkey... cheapest stuff possible.

I mean, most of the money got spent "keeping it up", not expanding or rerouting. There have been improvements along I81, just not enough.

so we are going to trust the people who planned poorly for I81 to "do it again" with a "probably" permanent funding stream in tolls? I hate toll roads but the initial pitch in the papers was "the trucks will be tolled" because they are the concern. we know we need money for infrastructure (up keep, improvement, and new stuff).... so... okay pay for your pass, etc. I just dont want to see this funding stream (use tax) get used for "something else" later. 

they need to make it so the funds cant be spent 10 miles east/west of I81. that way it can be spent to help ease traffic on and off... etc.

[CaptainHenreh]

Having a trucking registration fee/passenger registration fee built into our current registrations, or through gas tax is a far more effective and less costly way to tax those using roads.  

 

I am 100% against a gasoline tax for this purpose. The issue isn't people who live on the I-81 corridor, it's the 11 million tractor trailers per year traveling through Virginia on their way to god-knows-where.

A gasoline tax does not impact them. You can fill up wherever diesel is cheap and drive straight through Virginia without stopping. A toll means you don't pay unless you use the road, and an electronic-only toll is pretty inexpensive to implement. A gas tax means the least-offenders, yet greatest-sufferers pay the largest burden. Bullshit, no thank you.

[Kaan]

I'm with DJ, the cost of setting up a toll process/infrastructure strikes me as costly compared to just goosing the gas tax or something else a little.

Yeah but then how could the Chinese owned toll operating companies make any money?

They are actually from Spain... at least the 495/I66 hotlanes are.

Isn't Transurban Australian? Unless they're owned by some Spanish company.

https://www.transurban.com/roads-and-pro...th-america

i'll have to look through my emails... maybe it was the construction crew and/or the actual tolling infrastructure. I know it wasnt from the good ol' USA... my uncle in Turkey was like "how the hell are you guys letting this happen!?!?"

I ask him the same stuff about his president

---

Having a trucking registration fee/passenger registration fee built into our current registrations, or through gas tax is a far more effective and less costly way to tax those using roads.  

 

I am 100% against a gasoline tax for this purpose. The issue isn't people who live on the I-81 corridor, it's the 11 million tractor trailers per year traveling through Virginia on their way to god-knows-where.

A gasoline tax does not impact them. You can fill up wherever diesel is cheap and drive straight through Virginia without stopping. A toll means you don't pay unless you use the road, and an electronic-only toll is pretty inexpensive to implement. A gas tax means the least-offenders, yet greatest-sufferers pay the largest burden. Bullshit, no thank you.

I'm with you on this. but i think we need to adopt the NYC model (what did i just say?)... do you think locals pay all the tolls around that city? at worse they pay a very discounted toll (25 cents vs. $11). free for the people around I81, make the trucks pay!

with this $30 annual fee... they are still trying to get blood out of a stone. I will probably have to buy my inlaws a pass for christmas every year lol.

[Ken]

I'm with DJ, the cost of setting up a toll process/infrastructure strikes me as costly compared to just goosing the gas tax or something else a little.

Yeah but then how could the Chinese owned toll operating companies make any money?

They are actually from Spain... at least the 495/I66 hotlanes are.

Isn't Transurban Australian? Unless they're owned by some Spanish company.

https://www.transurban.com/roads-and-pro...th-america

i'll have to look through my emails... maybe it was the construction crew and/or the actual tolling infrastructure. I know it wasnt from the good ol' USA... my uncle in Turkey was like "how the hell are you guys letting this happen!?!?"

I ask him the same stuff about his president

---

Having a trucking registration fee/passenger registration fee built into our current registrations, or through gas tax is a far more effective and less costly way to tax those using roads.  

 

I am 100% against a gasoline tax for this purpose. The issue isn't people who live on the I-81 corridor, it's the 11 million tractor trailers per year traveling through Virginia on their way to god-knows-where.

A gasoline tax does not impact them. You can fill up wherever diesel is cheap and drive straight through Virginia without stopping. A toll means you don't pay unless you use the road, and an electronic-only toll is pretty inexpensive to implement. A gas tax means the least-offenders, yet greatest-sufferers pay the largest burden. Bullshit, no thank you.

I'm with you on this. but i think we need to adopt the NYC model (what did i just say?)... do you think locals pay all the tolls around that city? at worse they pay a very discounted toll (25 cents vs. $11). free for the people around I81, make the trucks pay!

with this $30 annual fee... they are still trying to get blood out of a stone. I will probably have to buy my inlaws a pass for christmas every year lol.

...What? Is there a discount i am not aware of that makes me pay less for the Holland/Lincoln Tunnel and/or George Washington bridge? 

If you're talking about the Thurway plan(s) which offer some discounts, it is decidedly not 25 cents vs. 11 dollars. More like 28 cents vs. 1 Dollar.  EZ-Pass discounts site.

EDIT: Mostly triggered by the thought that NY/NYC residents somehow only pay 25 cents for tolls - there is a discount, via EZ-Pass. But it's nowhere near that kind of discount. More like $11.52 vs. $17, as an example.

[D_Eclipse9916]

Having a trucking registration fee/passenger registration fee built into our current registrations, or through gas tax is a far more effective and less costly way to tax those using roads.  

 

I am 100% against a gasoline tax for this purpose. The issue isn't people who live on the I-81 corridor, it's the 11 million tractor trailers per year traveling through Virginia on their way to god-knows-where.

A gasoline tax does not impact them. You can fill up wherever diesel is cheap and drive straight through Virginia without stopping. A toll means you don't pay unless you use the road, and an electronic-only toll is pretty inexpensive to implement. A gas tax means the least-offenders, yet greatest-sufferers pay the largest burden. Bullshit, no thank you.

Hence increasing those trucking registration fees.  The Heavy Vehicle Use Tax should be upped which is a zero cost to citizens...

Unfortunately what I refer to as "intended" money buckets tend to be used everywhere vs where it is truly in need due to our political process.

As far as gasoline tax, it was a misnomer; trucks use diesel.  Up the diesel tax.  Private citizens can then keep their receipts and send in for the personal diesel tax exemption (which is available already now).  Every state is implementing these toll roads; and the overhead from having to invoice those who do not have EZ-passes (which is part of the process) costs tax payer's money along with all the sensors.  It's not quite as cheap as you are making it to be and is an ongoing cost.

[Kaan]

Yeah but then how could the Chinese owned toll operating companies make any money?

They are actually from Spain... at least the 495/I66 hotlanes are.

Isn't Transurban Australian? Unless they're owned by some Spanish company.

https://www.transurban.com/roads-and-pro...th-america

i'll have to look through my emails... maybe it was the construction crew and/or the actual tolling infrastructure. I know it wasnt from the good ol' USA... my uncle in Turkey was like "how the hell are you guys letting this happen!?!?"

I ask him the same stuff about his president

---

Having a trucking registration fee/passenger registration fee built into our current registrations, or through gas tax is a far more effective and less costly way to tax those using roads.  

 

I am 100% against a gasoline tax for this purpose. The issue isn't people who live on the I-81 corridor, it's the 11 million tractor trailers per year traveling through Virginia on their way to god-knows-where.

A gasoline tax does not impact them. You can fill up wherever diesel is cheap and drive straight through Virginia without stopping. A toll means you don't pay unless you use the road, and an electronic-only toll is pretty inexpensive to implement. A gas tax means the least-offenders, yet greatest-sufferers pay the largest burden. Bullshit, no thank you.

I'm with you on this. but i think we need to adopt the NYC model (what did i just say?)... do you think locals pay all the tolls around that city? at worse they pay a very discounted toll (25 cents vs. $11). free for the people around I81, make the trucks pay!

with this $30 annual fee... they are still trying to get blood out of a stone. I will probably have to buy my inlaws a pass for christmas every year lol.

...What? Is there a discount i am not aware of that makes me pay less for the Holland/Lincoln Tunnel and/or George Washington bridge? 

If you're talking about the Thurway plan(s) which offer some discounts, it is decidedly not 25 cents vs. 11 dollars. More like 28 cents vs. 1 Dollar.  EZ-Pass discounts site.

maybe they have gotten rid of them... its been a while since that was a part of my life. my recollection was the biggest discount was on the verrazano. 

either way... there is a huge discount. I'm against an annual fee or a fee for residence when their concerns and requests for upgrades have everything to do with interstate travel from trucks. SO... as initially proposed, let the trucks pay for it not the residence.

[Ken]

They are actually from Spain... at least the 495/I66 hotlanes are.

Isn't Transurban Australian? Unless they're owned by some Spanish company.

https://www.transurban.com/roads-and-pro...th-america

i'll have to look through my emails... maybe it was the construction crew and/or the actual tolling infrastructure. I know it wasnt from the good ol' USA... my uncle in Turkey was like "how the hell are you guys letting this happen!?!?"

I ask him the same stuff about his president

---

Having a trucking registration fee/passenger registration fee built into our current registrations, or through gas tax is a far more effective and less costly way to tax those using roads.  

 

I am 100% against a gasoline tax for this purpose. The issue isn't people who live on the I-81 corridor, it's the 11 million tractor trailers per year traveling through Virginia on their way to god-knows-where.

A gasoline tax does not impact them. You can fill up wherever diesel is cheap and drive straight through Virginia without stopping. A toll means you don't pay unless you use the road, and an electronic-only toll is pretty inexpensive to implement. A gas tax means the least-offenders, yet greatest-sufferers pay the largest burden. Bullshit, no thank you.

I'm with you on this. but i think we need to adopt the NYC model (what did i just say?)... do you think locals pay all the tolls around that city? at worse they pay a very discounted toll (25 cents vs. $11). free for the people around I81, make the trucks pay!

with this $30 annual fee... they are still trying to get blood out of a stone. I will probably have to buy my inlaws a pass for christmas every year lol.

...What? Is there a discount i am not aware of that makes me pay less for the Holland/Lincoln Tunnel and/or George Washington bridge? 

If you're talking about the Thurway plan(s) which offer some discounts, it is decidedly not 25 cents vs. 11 dollars. More like 28 cents vs. 1 Dollar.  EZ-Pass discounts site.

maybe they have gotten rid of them... its been a while since that was a part of my life. my recollection was the biggest discount was on the verrazano. 

either way... there is a huge discount. I'm against an annual fee or a fee for residence when their concerns and requests for upgrades have everything to do with interstate travel from trucks. SO... as initially proposed, let the trucks pay for it not the residence.

I edited after, i was little bit triggered by the thought of THAT much a discount.

Staten Island residents get a bit more on Verrazzano. It's still $5.50 vs $17 - not sure i qualify that as a huge discount. That's only on that bridge as well.