Car of the Decade?

[CaptainHenreh]

It's the price of oil/gas that drove sales and popularity of the Prius, not its technology.

Again, I gotta call bullshit. If this were true, then Civic hybrids would be flying off the lots in equal numbers since it's cheaper, not so goddamn ugly, and arguably more reliable. But they aren't because if you're riding around in a Civic hybrid nobody knows how big of a prick you are, so people don't buy 'em.

People aren't *really* concerned about the environment, they just want potential mates and rivals to think they are. (And to enjoy the smell of their own farts).

I can't believe I'm going to say this but I agree with almost everything you said, except for the part about the SRT4 being the car of the decade.

Well that's good because I didn't call it the car of the decade. "Sport Compact" of the decade, mebbe.

[Goodspeed]

Also, Goodspeed you're full of shit. A Car of the Decade that only 10 of which are actually running around, AND they're on an EV-1esque leasing program? And what's envirofriendly about a GTI? Oh, let's build a car in Germany (You hope!), and ship it halfway around the world so we can be friendly to the environment. Riiiiiiiiight.

Read my criteria for CotD again - the best car that represents the decade's automotive attitude. The Clarity, 10 or a million, is it. Its perhaps the greatest technological achievement in the automotive world relative to our needs encompassing a changing world-view. Suffering from a non-existent fuel network? Its cars like this that will create a hydrogen fuel network, not the other way around.

What's your point about shipping cars? Every car in the world is shipped everywhere, thats a moot point. I nominated the GTI because its a near-perfect blend of practicality, style, economy and fun. The 2010 DSG GTI gets 24/32, and that ain't bad. Its a fast car that has four seats starting at $24k. Damn worthy in my book.

I should also probably add the all-electric Tango and the Tata Nano as well as notable mentions.

[Apoc]

The crossover was a big deal to the masses, especially later in the decade. SUV practicality (and then some) without the truck frame and bad mpg. But I cant put a finger on 1 that started the trend or was even the leader.

That's where I'm coming from, so I would say the CR-V.

Seems like a lot of people are defining it through "car guy" eyes, which is fine, but not personally what I think should determine the "Car of the Decade". To be that, it has to be something that really changed how the genpop view purchasing a car. I think the Prius is a solid choice, but I don't know that it really changed the way most people buy cars.

[CaptainHenreh]

Read my criteria for CotD again - the best car that represents the decade's automotive attitude. The Clarity, 10 or a million, is it. Its perhaps the greatest technological achievement in the automotive world relative to our needs encompassing a changing world-view.

Whew, that post reads like a brochure. And it smells like one too. Hydrogen is a dead end, and if you think this decade has been all about "Let's be more efficient" then you're blind. Ostensibly that's what it's been about, and it's certainly been what the automotive press has been about, but you can't look me in the eye and say "Cars have become more efficient" because it's bullcrap.

Through college I drove a '94 Geo Metro and got 40 drive-it-like-i-stole-it honest to god miles to the gallon out of it. Highway, city, didn't matter, 40mpg. THAT was an efficient car. It had cold AC, a warm heater, seatbelts and 1 liter of fury. The Prius, 10 years later and the world's best automotive engineers gets 3 more miles to the gallon, and with a whole shitload more environmental damage. You can say the 2000's were about efficiency, but they weren't. They were about green windowdressing.

[ScottyB]

i'd nominate the Mini, although i'm still thinking on it. it brought back a great name (remember the huge fuss these things stirred up when they came out), became very successful in it's own right and as firing up the premium small car market, and proved Americans still dig tiny cars not just for economical reasons. you could get one for economy, for performance , a convertible, and even the electric version in some areas - and people were and are, buying the hell out of them despite their price. they still hold their value too.

marketing had alot to do with it but i think there's alot of substance behind the car, too.

[Goodspeed]

But you can't look me in the eye and say "Cars have become more efficient" because it's bullcrap.

Cars haven't become more efficient? C'mon Rex. You're kinda comparing apples to oranges here. For better or worse, current car buyers demand more luxury (read: weight adding) features. Driving a Geo Metro is all well and good, but the current Prius packs in its 2500 extra pounds things like a sunroof, 8 speaker stereo and side/curtain airbags, and it gets better mileage. How is that not more "efficient"?

Of course, something like a CRX HF will destroy all, if you enjoy masochistic driving and fearing for your life with every highway merge, but saying no new cars are as-or-more efficient than older cars is a bit much.

[CaptainHenreh]

For better or worse, current car buyers demand more luxury (read: weight adding) features.

But that's exactly my point. They aren't greener, they aren't better for the environment, they aren't decreasing our dependence on foreign oil...it's all window dressing, down to the last, and you bought it hook line and sinker. If what you really mean is "We now have 11 airbags for the driver and heated leather dickwarmers with 9 pulsation settings and only lost 2 MPG" then that's what you should say. But to pretend we're somehow saving the earth, or even our wallets, with all this "new" technology is disingenuous.

[Goodspeed]

And what I'm saying is you have to be realistic. Don't blame the cars, or even automakers half the time. Blame the NHTSA, or the EU as well. We're not going to go back to driving Model T's, but the age of spartan AFV/pure electric city vehicles is coming, like the Tango I mentioned earlier. Its going to be a hard pill to swallow for the general public that is just recently getting over the Excursion and H2.

You're writing as if I/we are heralding a vast change in consumer auto efficiency in the last decade, which is false. Nothing that drastic is going to happen in 10 years. But if you step back and look at the last 10 years on a timeline, the change has been remarkable. We went from SUVs to vast Prius sales and high level corporate/grassroots AFV innovation in just 10 years. If this rate of buyer demand and public perception change is going to continue, I expect to see great things by 2020.

And I haven't bought into anything. I drive one of those "enthusiast" Miatas, and I like turbo cars with no catalytic converters :wink:

[fiveoh2go]

But if you step back and look at the last 10 years on a timeline, the change has been remarkable.

You can step back and look at any decade starting from the 1950's and say the same thing.

We went from SUVs to vast Prius sales and high level corporate/grassroots AFV innovation in just 10 years.

First off the whole Prius argument is crap. People buy those cars for the "Hey look at me, I'm saving the environment" ego trip. As for the "high level corporate/grassroots AFV innovation"...if a company currently isn't on that band wagon they're looked upon as being heathens who don't care about the environment. Its politically motivated and used for marketing.



I say the proof is in the pudding and a "gas guzzling" truck has been the best selling vehicle in the US for 20+ years.

[G.Irish]

For car of the decade I'd have to go with the Prius too. It staked out new territory as the number 1 hybrid and it probably helped to push other automakers to create hybrids. I'd say it has had more influence and been more news-worthy than any other car of the decade. At least in the mainstream.

Are there downsides to the Prius and hybrids in general? Sure. It may save gas but the total environmental impact may not justify hybrids when you get into the production of the batteries. But at the very least it shows that people are willing to pay a premium for more environmentally-friendly products. Companies like Toyota and Honda have already publicly acknowledged that hybrids are a stop-gap anyway.

I find it a bit hypocritical to criticize the Prius because it is a 'look at me I'm driving a hybrid' fashion statement. Let's be honest, if the M3 looked exactly like every other BMW would it be as desirable? Of course not. Truth is that cars are almost always a fashion statement of some sort. A perceived statement a car is making probably influences almost all of the car buying decisions people here make. If some people want to buy a Prius or Insight or whatever to say, "Look at me, I'm environmentally friendly" who cares? Is it any more wrong than buying an econobox with a chin spoiler and a wing on it?

[G.Irish]

As for performance cars I'd have to agree with the WRX. It raised the bar for sport compact performance and paved the way for cars like the Evo and the other turbocharged sport compacts. The other worthy nominee would be the Corvette, as it redefined sportscar value. There's something to be said for giving the Italians a run for their money for less than half the cost.

[Steve85]

It's the price of oil/gas that drove sales and popularity of the Prius, not its technology.

Again, I gotta call bullshit. If this were true, then Civic hybrids would be flying off the lots in equal numbers since it's cheaper, not so goddamn ugly, and arguably more reliable. But they aren't because if you're riding around in a Civic hybrid nobody knows how big of a prick you are, so people don't buy 'em.

People aren't *really* concerned about the environment, they just want potential mates and rivals to think they are. (And to enjoy the smell of their own farts).

While I agree, I don't think that makes my point BS. Maybe they weren't flying off in equal numbers but I would bet they spiked...because gas prices spiked. My point is gas prices (not environmental concerns) drove the sales of hybrids in general, the Prius was the most popular and recognizable for several reasons. Why somebody looking for a hybrid instead of an SUV ultimately chose the Prius wasn't my point, it is a potential car of the decade because gas prices put it on the evening news for a year and a half.

[Sijray21]

with its global impact in urban/congested settings, i'll have to nominate the Smart City. with the only thing better for parking in urban situations being a scooter or motorcycle, this car has revolutionized the way parking is handled, especially in Europe.

[BLINGMW]

Even though I have little personal interest in them, I have to go with the WRX too. It made the best use of a lot of technology in an affordable and powerful package, fueled a whole culture here, and sold well because it wasn't limited to fanbois. Like it or not, it is an icon of both turbo and AWD technology becoming mature and mainstream.

I understand people saying Mustang or Corvette, they improved a LOT. But they've been done.... forever. If you're looking from a car guy standpoint, the WRX appeared and changed the game instantly, could be as fast as those cars for the same or less $, AND was more useful/practical as a DD.

I assume we're talking car of the decade in the US, right? Just wondering... it gets more complex if not. Cause then the WRX was nothing new and yeah, maybe it's the Smart car or something. :dunno:

Prius is a close second for me, and I wouldn't fault anyone for choosing it as #1. If you include greenwashing as a major theme of the decade, which it is, then the Prius is perfect. It actually IS a good car, and like the WRX, was a game changer, brought a lot of new tech in an affordable package.... sales, culture... blah blah, all the same stuff. From a performance standpoint though, it's an overpriced, overweight, overly complex econobox. :vomit:

Goodspeed, nice try. :evileye: Looks like most here agree, the thing has to be produced in some quantity and be able to be sold with some chance of profit to be car of the decade. Hydrogen prototypes existed through the '90s too, so with your apparent requirements, it should have been the car of the decade last decade. Hydrogen cars are hybrid electrics too, suffering the same issues of battery production and disposal that the Prius has. Hydrogen technology, for that, safety issues, AND the lack of a distribution network is not so clearly the "best". Like all hybrids, it's a temporary solution. Looking forward to 2020, battery tech will likely have improved enough to make hybrids of any kind an unnecessary curiosity of the past. Heck, for that reason, the Tesla you mentioned is a much better choice than the Honda thing. THAT car is the future.

[SlimKlim]

Car of the decade? I gotta side with someone earlier and the Top Gear guys in the last episode. The Bugatti Veyron was and is just biblical. And I imagine 2004-2010 is going to be somewhat like the late sixties. Epic horsepower and performance followed by general lameness and an oil crunch. The veyron's sheer acceleration and its godly top speed probably won't be seen in a street car for a long long time. If gasoline engines are really phasing out, then its going to take 20 years for people to figure out how to make something else go nearly that fast.

I can buy into the WRX thing too, if all the E36 M3s were smited simultaneously from the earth, a WRX would be my go to.

[G.Irish]

I disagree completely with the Veyron. The formula for that car was basically: "Build a big engine, add a lot of boost, make sure it doesn't flip at high speed." It doesn't handle particularly well and it is extremely heavy. To me, any number of manufacturers could build that car because it is utterly one-dimensional. It didn't move the supercar game on at all in my opinion.

[WRXtranceformed]

My vote goes, as much as I hate to say it, to the GTR. I would NEVER own one, I don't think it's particularly attractive and the notoriety of the weakness of its drivetrain components and the unwillingness of Nissan to warranty it are huge flaws of the car. But, with the progression of modern society toward computer-controlled devices pretty much running our lives (have you seen the press articles about mind-controlled robots and toys?) it pretty much sums up the direction in which automobile technology is heading. There will always be a place for raw, pure, RWD, no-electronic-nanny vehicles in a niche group of enthusiasts, but for the layperson the extra computer control is only going to be more desired and is going to be integrated further into the mass-produced vehicle realm.

I think the GTR really grabbed the spotlight and pointed it toward this fact by pissing off companies like Porsche to the point that Nissan was being called cheaters. The plain truth is that computers can control everything better than humans (with a few very minor exceptions). Putting this kind of technology into a sports car and breaking records around the Nurburgring is just the flashy way of demonstrating this point. I would not be surprised if in the next 50 years, assuming we're all still here, that passenger vehicles become completely automated...making issues like falling asleep at the wheel, drunk driving, aggressive driving, poor weather driving completely obsolete.