Help Mike pick a car!

[G.Irish]

Oh I forgot to ask you about the R32... I know a lot of you think its too heavy, but I've been trying to decide if I like them. The AWD and convenience of a hatch are appealing to me. The seats are also amazing. I read in Car and Driver that its not much faster than a 1.8T but its a perfect autox car. I guess since I'm used to a slow car, 240hp is not going to seem slow.

Actually the R32 makes a poor autocross car because of the weight. Heavy cars tend to be poor autocrossers unless they have a ton of power and a lot of rubber under them to make up for it (read: F Stock).

[G.Irish]

I dont know if you have thought of this, but the type of gas and how much of it the car guzzles makes a big difference. This is why my WRX has been sitting in my driveway for 6 months. Hell my Miata doesnt even have AC or power anything but i still drive it to work every day to keep from getting it up the ass at the gas station.

A very good point. Almost all of these cars get under 20 mpg in the city so that's somethign to think about for a DD. Another x factor is insurance. I'd check the insurance rates on either my top 5 or all of the cars to get a better idea of the real cost of the car.

[.RJ]

If the Porsche is even on your list then I say go for it 100%. I dont think you would regret it for a second. They are every bit as reliable as any of those other cars, and parts arent much worse than an M3.
I think they are more practical than people give them credit for. They do have a back seat!

They are still $$ to maintain... even oil changes (12 quarts of synthetic is going to add up real fast!).

[Mike]

I'm gonna begin looking in about 3 months.

[JackoliciousLegs]

If the Porsche is even on your list then I say go for it 100%. I dont think you would regret it for a second.

I agree...

parts arent much worse than an M3.

Incorrect. Parts for an M3 are bad. Parts for a porsche 993 are astronomical. I was looking into buying a 944 turbo before my rx7 days. Man oh man. I went to the porsche dealership with a list of parts for the 944 and asked prices. Needless to say, I decided against it.

300ZTT: Heavy, buelevard cruiser.

That does a 4.8s 0-60.

I think the TT is a much better car as far as Audis go.

You might be the only person on earth that likes the TTs.

I agree with Evan about the Porsche tho. Considering they really don't go below 25K in good shape for one, I think it might be a bit out of your range. I almost agree with Gerald on the 325/8. Kinda... Buy one of those or an M3 for now. Save up. Sell the M and buy the Porsche. Evan is right. You'll never regret buying that Porsche when you get on the road with it. When you get the bill for replacing the clutch on the other hand...

[.RJ]

Incorrect. Parts for an M3 are bad

No they're not.

Only the E30's.

[ScottyB]

hey what about an M coupe Mike? it's not that different from your hatchcrap, except that it will be like your hatchcrap on crack and with the drive wheels at the other end. sure it doesnt have a back seat, but i bet a body or two would fit in the hatch. and it uses old BMW suspension parts, bonus!

[Mike]

I don't like M Coupes.

[Evan]

Incorrect. Parts for an M3 are bad. Parts for a porsche 993 are astronomical. I was looking into buying a 944 turbo before my rx7 days.

As I understand it, the 944s (especially turbos) were a maintenence anomoly that didnt apply to the 911s. A friend of a friend runs a porsche repair shop said that older 911s were dead reliable and reasonably cheap to maintain. Of course that could be relative (like to a ferrari), or he could be bias, but a few others have said similar things (like Payton Wilson - ironically right after he couldnt get the car into 3rd gear) of course YMMY and all that.

That does a 4.8s 0-60.

*shrug* number racing is stupid IMO. (btw I couldnt find anything to back up that 4.8 number)
The mid-90s 300z has always been shunned by those who call themselves "true" Z enthusiasts because of its departure from a raw sports car to a cruiser. This is a large reason why Nissan released a "Track model" of the new Z.

You might be the only person on earth that likes the TTs.

Not sure how these "other people on earth" relate to the discussion, but having spent considerable time in both cars, at the limit, on the racetrack, I think the TT is a vastly superior performance vehicle.

My opinions are based more on pure performance than street daily driving, but the thing about the 993 is that it does both perfectly.

[.RJ]

As I understand it, the 944s (especially turbos) were a maintenence anomoly that didnt apply to the 911s. A friend of a friend runs a porsche repair shop said that older 911s were dead reliable and reasonably cheap to maintain.

Pretty spot on - Maintenance on a 911 didnt appear to be any worse than most (in terms of the amount of b0rken stuff) when I worked @ HBL, but when you needed work it wasnt cheap - however they were solid and did not break very often and most of the $$ spent was on service, clutch, etc.

I want a RS America

[PDenbigh]

I hate people who drive trucks, gas mileage sucks, they are less refined than cars, I don't plan on having anything to tow in the near future.

You've lived a sheltered life haven't you?

[Mike]

I hate people who drive trucks, gas mileage sucks, they are less refined than cars, I don't plan on having anything to tow in the near future.

You've lived a sheltered life haven't you?

Tell me where I'm wrong. Don't say an F150 gets the gas mileage of an M3, or that it is just as refined as an M3...

I respect trucks for what they can do, but lets be honest, 85% of the people who drive them don't need them. I now realize I should have qualified my truck-bashing more properly.

[JohnC]

I hate people who drive trucks, gas mileage sucks, they are less refined than cars, I don't plan on having anything to tow in the near future.

You've lived a sheltered life haven't you?

Tell me where I'm wrong. Don't say an F150 gets the gas mileage of an M3, or that it is just as refined as an M3...

I respect trucks for what they can do, but lets be honest, 85% of the people who drive them don't need them. I now realize I should have qualified my truck-bashing more properly.

My Lightning is at least as refined as an M3.*




*M3 must be have square wheels and a 2-stroke chainsaw engine. Seats must be constructed of plywood and duct tape. Salvage title cars only.

[white_2kgt]

Tell me where I'm wrong. Don't say an F150 gets the gas mileage of an M3, or that it is just as refined as an M3...

Nor does it cost anywhere near the same amount of $$ upfront or in the long run w/ parts/service. If you don't need a truck then by all means don't get one. I was going on the ASSumption that you intended to track _some_ vehicle, in that case a parts chaser and tow vehicle comes in mighty handy, but if you just plan on being a yuppy then just put them all in a hat and pick one out. If I ain't gonna see you on the track w/ it I couldn't give a rats ass.

-c

[REED]

my rankings would go

1. S4 - One of my personal favorites, I consider the styling more subtle than bland, small mods = big power, pretty practical, excellant interior which should be important as it is solely a daily driver
2. M3 - Styling is similar to S4, Good interior - maybe a bit dated, respected in the "world of cars"
3. G35 - I would say this is right behind the M3, a plus is that it would be new or near new so you get some sort of warranty, more of a pimp factor than sports car - do they come in manuals?
4. 933 - if you think you can afford it i would go for it, maybe not as practical as the others and a little on the expensive side
STi - good choice if you want all out performance, a little bare for a daily driver
Evo - same as sti, cheaper interior
Supra - hott with two Ts, and somewhat impractical
S2000 - barely less practical than a supra
300ZX - old and most likely beaten up
2.5RS - cheap.....and its cheap

for me the interior and the practicality matter most as a daily driver followed by gas mileage, i would think most of these would need premium fuel too, in the end i would probly go for the S4 if i wasnt completly in love with the RX-8 ( which i know you arnt a fan of)

[Mike]

Yes, I'm a yuppy because I want to drive a nice car. Lets not take in to account I've driven without air conditioning or power anything for the past 6 years... hrug:

Mike, who is building a civic just so he can track his daily driver...

[KPWSerpiente]

Mike, it is time for you to ditch that crappy ass b16 or whatever you have and step up to a real man's engine. Forget about buying a new car and just concentrate on swapping in something like this:





-T

[Dave]

my opnions, for what they are worth...
-E36 M3: I love this car. If I was going to buy a BMW, this would be it. Fast, seems to be fairly reliable, incredible car to drive, and fun. Not to mention you've had a hard-on for these for a while.
-G35: Expensive right now, wait and buy one used and see how they handle several years of driving. Not my pick, but not a bad car.
-Evo 8: I'm not particularly fond of Mitsu build quality. Fast little 4-door car and fun to drive, but might be lacking for a daily driver/commuter car
-Porsche: Dude, you have to have something else to get later in life. Get something else now, get this later.
-Audi: I know nothing of this car, so I won't put anything into it.
-S2000: Fun to drive, not pracitical at all. Honda reliability, might miss having storage space for a daily driver.
-Supra: I will bitch-smack you if you buy one of these before I can convert mine. This car has the potential of any car you listed here. Glad it made it onto the list though. TTs are pretty hard to come by, and even harder to find that aren't ragged out. Maintenance isn't a big deal on these cars in comparison to others on the list and it is quite reliable. I guess I'd have to consider you a big brother, although at this point I'd still own you in turns and such if you bought a stock TT. Like you said, rear seat is for show, they are still expensive, and it will be very hard to find one in immaculate condition.
-2.5RS: AWD, great daily driver, although pretty underpowered considering its competition here.
-STi: b00st, fun as shit, fast, great handling, 4-doors, need I go on. The perfect car in my perception. However, Maeng already has one and we need to spice up the different types of cars we have. Maybe if you get something cool, you and Maeng can work out a trade for a couple days....
-300z: much cheaper than a supra. Makes back seat on supra look like couch. Styling is alright but still not as timeless as the supra. I6>V6 Looks a lot harder to work on compared to supra and doesn't ave the amount of potnetial. If you are really considiering any of the 90s supercars, I would put the 300 as a tie for 2nd place with the FD, behind the supra in 1st. These are even harder to find in good condition, although thier average price is much lower than the supra. I also think that John might kick you in the nuts if you happened to pull up next to him at an MM event

[JohnC]

I also think that John might kick you in the nuts if you happened to pull up next to him at an MM event

I still can't get these things out of my head. All the issues you mentioned, and I still want one just because... I dunno. However, the price of a decent TT Z32 (good luck finding a clean Z32 - far and few between) is right up there with an M3, and I'd agree that the M3 is by far the more logical track day / autox car. And that Z32 engine bay is pretty imposing, for the total lack of any free space at all. Dollar for dollar, I think an M3 is the way to go, and I may take that path eventually as well...

[REED]

jack has a top gear pitting an S4 vs. an M3 and i feel he said it best "for one lap around a track I would take the M3, but for everyday the S4" just a note the S4 was 1 second quicker than the M3 around the track in the dry (the newest versions of both cars)