09-12-2006, 07:18 PM
Evan Wrote:You personally know all the muslims of the world?
No, but I know a lot more than you
Evan Wrote:Dont try to put words in my mouth or jump to the conclusion that I said all muslims are terrorists. I have no doubts in my mind that the majority of the muslims in this country are just as patriotic as I am, and I have never and will never look at an arab and think to myself he is a muslim.
My point is that the terrorism, jihadists, and radical movement has moved past a miniscule perverted sect of islam and is showing influence in mainstream Islam to the point where there is no solid division.
Your saying "Im not going to play politically correct with the whole terrorism and Muslim connections" did sound like you didn't care to distinguish the two, and instead would prefer to lump the all the followers of the Islamic faith into the terrorist category. If thats not the case, then good. Because there sure are a hell of a lot of people in this country who do just that and prove to others that they are no more educated than those who turn to extremism.
Evan Wrote:...If anything you just proved my point. Thats a lot of countries, but you arent finished.
You're leaving out the African Muslim countries which is the largest area of growth of fundamentalist Islam. In Sudan alone over 2 million christians have been killed over the past 10 years. Libya has a long history of sponsoring terrorism.
And lets not forget countries like Saudi Arabia (whose official -and required- religion is Wahhabism) and Pakistan who play friends with us politically but turn their heads and pretend not to notice the massive terrorist movements in their borders.
Then of course there is Palestine where the "tiny minority of radicals" managed to elect a terrorist group into political power.
I never denied any of this...I was only giving examples that I had good enough knowledge of off the top of my head. Yes, there is a massive spread of fundamentalist Islam in Africa, but you're still not getting it...I'm trying to get you to distinguish between REAL Islam and this fundamentalist BS. I've been to dozens of Mosques, I went to Palestine last Christmas, I've lived in countries where 9/11 hijackers came from, and they were some of the nicest, most peaceful people in the world. You would never be able to find more hospitable and caring people if you tried. The extremists ARE the minority. Look at Sudan, Somalia, etc...they've been having large scale massacres and civil war for decades, it was only recently that fire was added to fire and fundamentalist Islamic teachings moved in, again the FEW are using the MANY to spread their twisted ideals. Again this ties into my belief that we should've left Iraq alone and focused on Afghanistan/Pakistan to erase the root of all this. If anything Africa is an intensified example of the poorest regions of the Middle East, they've been suffering a lot longer so it should be no surprise to any of us that they are turning to extremism. Its as others put it: Lack of Education + desperation = Terrorist.
Evan Wrote:So that makes it ok to turn to terrorists, to praise the killings of thousands? Unfortunately there is plenty of poverty in this world (and the US is contributing more than anyone else to fight that) but most of them dont start killing people or supporting killing people just because they are poor. And guess what, the millions of dollars in terrorist funding isnt coming from the poor folks
Of course it doesn't make it OK, but what other alternative do they have? Are they supposed to sit in their shithole cinder block houses with no job, no money and starving kids and like it? Or they can join a terrorist organization, recieve funding for their families, a new home built (yes they do that for families of those who join), and a status and purpose in life? They don't JUST join because they are poor. They join because they have no education. They join because they have nothing else to live for. And when someone comes to them offering money and a promising new way of life and tell them that America has caused all their problems, they join.
Evan Wrote:I agree to a certain extent, but you are completely ignoring the expansion of radical Islam in developed democratic countries like britain and educated muslims.
Why does that happen? Because Muslims in Europe are marginalized and discriminated against all throughout Europe. In England they're called "Pakis", in France they are forced to live in shitty government housing and take poor paying jobs (hence the massive car burning riots earlier this year), its their own civil rights movement that is happening right now, so obviously some are going to slip through the cracks and resort to extremism. Britain does have a BIG problem on their hands I'm not denying that, they made a big mistake allowing fundamentalist preachers into their country spreading that BS.
Evan Wrote:If you think for 1 second thats what I have been saying then you didnt bother to read what I wrote (or lack the comprehension skills to understand it) and just used it to springboard your cookie cutter CAIR propaganda routine
My cookie cutter propaganda argument? WTF? Go live in the middle east for eight years then come talk that shit to me. Go live in Iran-Iraq War era Baghdad in the 80's like my family has. Go out in the middle of the Jordanian desert and build homes all weekend for poor peasants and talk to them like I did. Two years ago there were three semi-truck sized truck bombs parked in my neighborhood in Jordan waiting to blow up the Embassy where I've worked just down the street, as part of a Zarqawi/Al Qaeda plan. I've come face to face with this shit, so don't think I don't know what I'm talking about, I certianly have more personal experience with this religion and with these people.