race seats/harnesses w/o cage?

[BLINGMW]

so I'm looking for a set of race seats, which pretty much means I have to get harnesses too....

what's the consensus, do I have to get a cage (or at least rollbar) at the same time? The only reason I've heard to not have race seats without a bar is that when the car rolls, and you're strapped in, you can't duck if the roof doesn't hold up. IMHO, that's pretty silly reasoning.

Your thoughts?

[Mike]

i think it's great reasoning. i wouldn't risk it, your spine and head are important.

[JohnC]

I'm with Mike - You definitely want a rollbar if you have harnesses.

[BLINGMW]

ok, guess I'll clarify my thinking.

I would think that race seats/harnesses are safer for track use even without the cage because they do a much better job of holding you in place, keeping your body from flopping around in a wreck. In any wreck that did NOT involve a rollover, I think the race seats would be better. Agreed?

Now if the car DOES rollover, I would think the race seats still usually win. Only in the specific case of rollover plus roof crushed in are they questionable. From what I've seen, in most rollovers, the roof usually holds up pretty well. It was designed to.

So my "silly reasoning" comment is that race seats alone seem much better for let's say, 95% of accidents that might occur. However, they're probably worse 5% of the time. Overall, I think they makes for a much better chance of surviving an accident.

It kind of reminds me of the people who used to justify not wearing a seatbelt because if the car ended up under water, it would delay their exit. :roll: Yes, in some small % of accidents, I'm sure seatbelts, airbags, all that stuff end up doing more harm than good. But overall, obviously, they help a lot.

So that's my question. Are race seats/harnesses MORE safe overall than regular seats? Obviously adding the cage takes it to the next level, but I see the race seats alone as an intermediate safety step, not a step backwards. Is being scared of the "roof crushed in" incident kind of like being scared of not being able to exit the car in case of water landing?

(Any data? I wish. Please share if you've got some)

[.RJ]

(Any data? I wish. Please share if you've got some)

I was told the NASA CCR will be updated with wording that will prevent the use of fixed seats and harnesses w/o rollover protection.

Either way:

[Mike]

yes you're correct that you're probably safer in 95% of all accidents, but in that other 5% you're f'd by a much larger margin than you're helped in all those other. hope you understand what i'm trying to say, my head hurts. you might have difficulty getting an instructor to get in your car too, considering they likely won't share the same thoughts as you. you may be solo now so it doesn't matter, but certainly something to think about if you aren't.

[white_2kgt]

You know better than this. Don't do harnesses/seats w/o at least a roll bar, minimum you will need a harness bar so go ahead and do the main hoop as well.

--chad

[Maengelito]

so what do you all think of a race seat without harnesses or rollbar like i've got now? i'm still able to use the factory seatbelt.

[BLINGMW]

why do those pics crack me up? Maybe because that's EXACTLY what RJ's bimmer would look like if he tracked it? :lol:

well alright, I didn't know about the possible amendment to the CCR, and I don't want to scare off instructors, so I guess I'll have to get a hoop too... *sigh* :wink:

still not convinced, but those are good enough reasons to justify the extra $$.

cool deal

[Mike]

so what do you all think of a race seat without harnesses or rollbar like i've got now? i'm still able to use the factory seatbelt.

better support, lighter weight, i don't see any downsides.

[Kaan]

better support, lighter weight, i don't see any downsides.

except the seat wasnt designed to bed used with a traditional lap 3 pointer... i dont think it would be as snugg, especially in a seat with high side bolsters.

[.RJ]

You can make that work w/ a stock seatbelt

[white_2kgt]

You can make that work w/ a stock seatbelt

I've not seen your seat, but more than likely riceJ is correct.

--chad

[Evan]

my 3 point works better with an evo than with the stock seat. it sits lower on the hips and stays tight better.

however maeng the downside to buckets with no rollbar is that the seat cannot be bent backwards in a wreck. not a huge deal, but i wouldnt run it that way for too many events

[JohnC]

my 3 point works better with an evo than with the stock seat. it sits lower on the hips and stays tight better.

however maeng the downside to buckets with no rollbar is that the seat cannot be bent backwards in a wreck. not a huge deal, but i wouldnt run it that way for too many events

Dibs on the STi and the kegerator if Maeng is crushed to death by the roof of his Integra.

[Mike]

dibs on the brake setup from the teg. oh yeah, his teg wheels too. i don't want much!

[BLINGMW]

awww I feel special. You guys want me to be safe. But Maeng? Yeah, head on out there. I got dibs! :lol:

[Mike]

you can have his mom... most of us are sick of her.

[Evan]

you can have his mom... most of us are sick of her.

speak for yourself