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+--- Thread: Unarmed Suspect Shot in the back by BART police (/showthread.php?tid=7904)
Unarmed Suspect Shot in the back by BART police - G.Irish - 01-04-2009
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The video is kinda long but you can see that the dude was on the ground and it didn't look like he was resisting. For my money I don't think the cop shot him on purpose but it's fucked up just the same. I don't know what the penalty would be for an accidental firing that caused a death but at the very least there'll be a wrongful death lawsuit.
- Apoc - 01-04-2009
At the risk of sounding insensitive (okay so it's probably more than a risk), why should I care?
- G.Irish - 01-04-2009
Well for me, there are quite a few posts that I don't care about. So you know, I don't post in them.
It interests me because nowadays there is a lot of this. In the past all manner of police misconduct would go unpunished. But now with video it's out in the open for all to see and it's a lot harder to cover up. I don't about others but I am very interested in having a police force that is going to uphold the law and now abuse it.
And in the video one of the officers was trying to get the camera from the girl who took the video so it leads me to believe that it probably would've been covered up if not for a girl with a camera.
- Apoc - 01-04-2009
It was more of an "I" as in why should "society" care.
I don't doubt police abuse their powers but people need to also be responsible for their actions. Death is a harsh punishment for fighting on a train but this sort of stuff rarely happens to people who are acting as responsible citizens. It's extremely unfortunate that he died but the only person I feel sorry for in this story is his daughter... who he wasn't at home with.
- G.Irish - 01-04-2009
Eh, it's hard to say whether he was being responsible or irresponsible. There are lots of ways for fights to start that aren't necessarily the result of behaving irresponsibly. Not to mention the fact that he may not have been directly involved. That said, my guess is that this guy probably was fighting for no good reason but the point is that you shouldn't get shot when you are cooperating with the police. I mean, we all have at least one friend who has gotten in a fight. I doubt anyone would be so cavalier if they got shot dead by the police while cooperating.
I guess sometimes accidental discharges happen whether they be civilians or law enforcement. However the standard is much higher for law enforcement not to make a mistake like that. If this was an accidental discharge it at least raises the question of whether BART police's firearm training is adequate and whether they need to review their training program.
Anytime police misconduct harms citizens it erodes the public's confidence in law enforcement and makes things more difficult for everyone on both sides of the badge.
- PGK - 01-05-2009
Being shot dead by a cop whilst cooperating with said cop isn't an acceptable solution for a misdemeanor offense. I really can't think of any other way to view the situation.
Police officers are charged with upholding the law, preserving order, protecting and serving society. I don't see how shooting unarmed people is doing any of those things.
This isn't a gray area.
As far as the possibility of a mechanical failure.... mechanical failures are fairly easy to prove. Most 'accidents' with firearms are accidents in the sense that the operators 'accidentally' ignored or forgot safety precautions.
- CaptainHenreh - 01-05-2009
PGK Wrote:All 'accidents' with firearms are accidents in the sense that the operators 'accidentally' pulled the trigger.
FTFY.
There's no such thing as "Accidental Discharges", only "Negligent Discharges".
- Ole - 01-05-2009
Seems to me it was a very tense situation with a crowd yelling at police officers prior to the shot. I'm not police officer, but I can imagine the officers felt it was necessary to have their weapons at the ready. The individual may have attempted to go after the officerÔÇÖs gun etc. Very hard to tell with that version of the video, exactly what was happening. I would not rush to judgment of anyone in this case.
I have a friend that is an officer in So. Fl. He had an unfortunate situation where some idiot went for his gun during a routine arrest. The idiot ended up getting shot and killed. It all happened very quickly as seems to be the case here. While there are a few police officers that are jerks, etc. most are trying very hard to do a very difficult job.
- HAULN-SS - 01-05-2009
I agree with that..what the hell is all the yelling about? That video doesn't actually show anything, and you can barely hear the shot over the crowd. With 4 or 5 other officers around, and only one shot fired, I have a feeling this will get thrown out.
- Ole - 01-08-2009
Well now it appears that the officer acted improperly. New video and the fact that the officer has resigned makes it appear that it may have been an accident, but it doesn't look at all like it was. If the officer is guilty, I hope justice prevails.
- HAULN-SS - 01-08-2009
I read something like he may have tried to reach for his stun-gun and grabbed the wrong thing. Is that possible?
- Evan - 01-08-2009
sounds like a BS excuse to me. Since your life could depend on grabbing the correct weapon, you know exactly which side you holster your stun gun and which side you holster your firearm.
Not to mention, they are completely different once you get them in your hand, and are used completely differently.
- G.Irish - 01-08-2009
BS excuse for sure. If you can't tell the difference between a handgun and a stun gun you are clearly incompetent and not fit to be a police officer. It would be much better if he just said, "I pulled my gun and in the commotion I made a mistake." Trying to make up nonsense excuses only makes the situation worse.
I still don't believe he shot the guy on purpose but just the same he should probably be in jail. That female officer that was trying to get the camera from one of the witnesses should be reprimanded as well. She has no right to demand a private citizen's camera like that and it makes it look like her intent was to cover things up.
Unfortunately this situation has already been used as an excuse for some knuckleheads to do some looting and rioting. I hope the powers that be in Oakland and SF are smart enough to take steps to prevent this from spiraling out of control.
- HAULN-SS - 01-08-2009
![[Image: 44002.jpg]](http://www.defendingwomen.com/images/womens_defense/44002.jpg)
I agree..I'm just saying..
- Mike - 01-08-2009
why did he even need to be tazed? they pretty clearly had him under control.
- PGK - 01-08-2009
Mike Wrote:why did he even need to be tazed? they pretty clearly had him under control.
especially after they shot him.
- Evan - 01-08-2009
in a related story, from our own commonwealth,
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gotta tase those unruly mentally retarded hula hoopers
- Mike - 01-08-2009
Definitely not proper use of a taser. She wasn't threatening his safety in any way (I see it said she had assaulted him? I didn't see it and even if she did she didn't appear to be doing it when he tased her THREE TIMES). How could he not understand she was mentally challenged? Was he deaf? Blind?
Fuck.
- CaptainHenreh - 01-09-2009
"Less Lethal" enforcement tools are the worst thing to happen to Law Enforcement in 20 years.
- Maengelito - 01-09-2009
CaptainHenreh Wrote:"Less Lethal" enforcement tools are the worst thing to happen to Law Enforcement in 20 years.
thats tough to say. It just gives them another option. You only hear about when things go wrong but there are a boatload of times where it goes as planned. But we're starting to get into the "what if" game, and thats never good for anything...