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+--- Thread: Phantom Grip LSD Insert (/showthread.php?tid=2062)
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Phantom Grip LSD Insert - JustinG - 04-09-2005
OK, wanna get the phantom grip, because i cant afford a true LSD and ive done research on this insert and ive heard good and bad things, mostly good though, but the usual horror stories. any opinions
??????
- ScottyB - 04-09-2005
big no no. they tear your diff up and don't even work much better than an open diff. do not, by any means, waste your money on this product.
- JustinG - 04-09-2005
i didnt want to hear that....anybody got 1200 laying around i coudl...um...borrow???
- .RJ - 04-09-2005
get a real diff - for street use, the quaife is the shizzle dizzle.
- mpg9999 - 04-09-2005
I have heard opinions both good and bad about it. The only real data I have ever seen was from NPM, and for the cost of it, it worked very well. I would love to see some real information on it other then I read that it sucks.
Yeah, the quaife is the shizzle dizzle
- KPWSerpiente - 04-09-2005
Marco at Magnus in Canadia disagrees with ya'll on the Quaife.
http://www.magnusmotorsports.com/article_kaazvstorsen.htm
-T
- G.Irish - 04-09-2005
I am hesitant to take advice from anyone who considers themself a professional who starts out with:
Quote:First off: we get the same questions from people when they ask us why we don't sell Torsen type LSD's. First of all we don't like the people at that 'other LSD company' they're d***. Secondly in our opinion they sell an inferior product that is way overpriced. The dudes at KAAZ are really cool, and the KAAZ LSD is one of the baddest LSD's out there and we're going to list the reasons why we only sell KAAZ.
If Quaife has bad customer service than say that but calling people dicks when you're a business owner is childish and unprofessional. Matter of fact, that whole page sounds like it was written by a 16 year old. For the most part racers will agree on the clutch type diff thing but I disagree with his whole argument about one wheel being off the ground. In road racing having a drive wheel off the ground is pretty rare. Maybe if you jump over some speed curbing but even then its rarely for more than an instant.
- mpg9999 - 04-09-2005
How often do you lift a front wheel off the ground while racing? The answer for most people is almost never.
- mpg9999 - 04-09-2005
I should add, given then choice between a quaife and a 1.5 way nismo lsd, I'd go with the Nismo.
- G.Irish - 04-09-2005
mpg9999 Wrote:How often do you lift a front wheel off the ground while racing? The answer for most people is almost never.
That is, if you've got a FWD car
- KPWSerpiente - 04-09-2005
I'm sorry G.
I guess I should question whether or not he is a pro at all..I mean owning a shop, racing in multiple pro series and earning his livelyhood as not only an automotive technician, engine builder and race car driver but as a writer for the occasional periodical certainly makes him sound unqualified to give an opinion, let alone a pro one.
-T
- G.Irish - 04-09-2005
KPWSerpiente Wrote:I'm sorry G.
I guess I should question whether or not he is a pro at all..I mean owning a shop, racing in multiple pro series and earning his livelyhood as not only an automotive technician, engine builder and race car driver but as a writer for the occasional periodical certainly makes him sound unqualified to give an opinion, let alone a pro one.
-T
Glad you see things my way
- CaptainHenreh - 04-09-2005
Travis, just FYI, a professional is not "someone who does a certain thing or another for a living." It's more than that.
Secondly, while a clutchpack LSD is certainly better than a viscous one (if louder and not as smooth) I disagree with certain points of this guy's "argument" if it can be called that.
The first bit is:
Quote: Manufacturers, and race teams alike (Mazdaspeed, Nismo, etc) use the clutch type design.Well, race teams do, because clutch pack LSD's are easy to maintain and adjust. But manufacturers, by and large, do not. In fact, I can only think of two factory applications of a clutchpack LSD: The MkIII Supra Turbo and the Z31 300ZX. Every other application is either viscous or Torsen.
On the other hand, what is at the rear of the Mazdaspeed MX-5? A torsen. The FD RX-7? Torsen. MKIII Supra 2.5 TT GT? Oh yeah, they ditched the clutchpack and went with a torsen. 1000 HP Killer "B" Audi Quattro? Yeah, it had a torsen. S15 Spec R Silvia? Torsen. Integra Type R? I'll give you two guesses. Yeah, it's torsen.
DSM? Open. (Or viscous)
Finally, a Torsen differential proactively prevents slip. It adjusts torque according to available traction. A clutchpack, on the other hand, makes the wheels turn the same direction. So which is better? Depends on your application.
For Mr. White97DSM, the differential setup I would reccomend would include a front, middle, and rear.
- JustinG - 04-10-2005
first of all thanks for callin me mr. second of al i apologize for tonight was a fiun night and im dont quiote undertsnad antyhing right now. ok....so are you sayin i shoul dgo with the insert??????? or the tru lsd?????i woudl prefer the incsert. :lol:
- JustinG - 04-10-2005
o..and im
FWD so i have no middle and rear
- .RJ - 04-10-2005
mpg9999 Wrote:How often do you lift a front wheel off the ground while racing? The answer for most people is almost never.
Uh......
IMHO, if i were going to race a honda, an OEM ITR/CTR Torsen is adequate - but I think a quaife or a clutch pack is going to be far better at putting power to the ground. With a bone stock engine I would still get some inside wheelspin in tight corners and every time i'd launch off a curb the car would hesitate as it came down as the tire was just freewheeling.
- G.Irish - 04-10-2005
G.Irish Wrote:Maybe if you jump over some speed curbing but even then
its rarely for more than an instant.
Lemme correct myself...Maybe if you drive like RJ your wheels are off the ground a lot.
- CaptainHenreh - 04-10-2005
white97dsm Wrote:o..and im
FWD so i have no middle and rear
I was suggesting you rectify that whole "no middle and rear" situation.
- Evan - 04-10-2005
For road racing, Ill take a torsen over a clutch diff.
For drifting and drag racing, Ill take a clutch
- .RJ - 04-10-2005
G.Irish Wrote:Lemme correct myself...Maybe if you drive like RJ your wheels are off the ground a lot.
I wish I had some pictures from Shenandoah...... there were a couple places I had 2 wheels launched off the curbing :twisted: