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+--- Thread: Why do some people have problems comprehending email? (rant) (/showthread.php?tid=9531)
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Why do some people have problems comprehending email? (rant) - BLINGMW - 07-21-2011
Give me your thoughts. Email is a great tool for business communication:
-Allows you to carry on a conversation with multiple people without any of them being available at the same time
-Allows you to organize your thoughts, questions, and get what you want out there, the way you meant to say it
-Gives you a searchable paper trail for your communications
-Allows for document transfer, supporting attachments
So when I get an email from someone in my company, I will read it. If they took the time to write it and thought I might care, I will at least scan over it and see what's relevant to me. Sure, I might be busy, and not read it 'till the end of the day, but I'll look at it. I owe my co-workers that. Certainly for a client email too.
SO WHY then, if someone has been using computers and email every day for 10+ years in business, would they not do the same? Why, when I take 30 min to hash something out, organize my thoughts, present a sorted list of questions, thoughts, answers, whatever, would someone read like the first line, then answer to the whole group, ignoring the bulk of equally relevant content, and make themselves look foolish, wasting everyone's time and forcing me to ask again or call them and read the damn email to them?
AND WHY would they still make rookie mistakes, like not looking at the distribution list to see who they're talking to, if they've accidentally attached a client, or their boss? Not looking at the inline conversation content before they go forwarding it to someone who shouldn't see it?
I'd like to hear your experiences. Or maybe you suck at email too and have a defense? Now, it's *mostly* people a older than me of course, but not old enough that it's an excuse (I'm not talking about your Grandma here). Email is NOT new. I just wonder what I would do, how I would interpret such ignorance, in a technology related company, if I were in charge of a well paid, salaried employee who couldn't use this tool correctly? I'd treat it as if they couldn't use the phone. Or a light switch. Is it inappropriate to interpret a lack of understanding of basic tools as a lack of intelligence? I think I would just have to fire them. :dunno:
Re: Why do some people have problems comprehending email? (r - JustinG - 07-21-2011
I know here (Capital One) if you can't function with email you cant function at all, especially in my position where alot of my work is administrative and involves communicating with a crap ton of people throughout the day, in different locations (Mclean/Plano/India), so face to face can't happen. 90% of the interactions here are through email or IM, even if the person is just down the hall, so if you cant get that then you probably wont be here for long.
I for one am always anal about triple/quadruple reading my emails/distribution lists so I dont sound like a retard. Especially since sometimes I dont know who the person on the other end is/their position, considering the size of this place.
I cant count how many times I have saved my own ass by someone saying I never received this or this, and im able to pull up an exact time and date the email was sent. Definately ups the accountability of people when it is stored in email, and they have no excuses.
Maybe in some instances it is a time issue and the people are in a rush to respond? or he was on his blackberry, and the email was formatted incorrectly?
But to consistently F-up at something as simple as email while working for an Tech based company is pretty inexcusable.
Re: Why do some people have problems comprehending email? (r - Apoc - 07-21-2011
People are inconsiderate, selfish and generally pretty stupid. Email doesn't change that.
People, both professional and personally, are amazed at how clean and organized my email/inbox is. Judging from some of the inboxes I've seen, I think most people are just so disorganized they don't feel they can take the time to give it the attention it deserves.
The inability to respond time a timely fashion (or at all) is what pisses me off the most.
Re: Why do some people have problems comprehending email? (r - CaptainHenreh - 07-21-2011
I got to the point at my last job that I simply refused to call people, and did almost 100% of my communication either face to face or via email.
Why? Because either I've got a record of what they said (and when they said it) or they have to look me in the eye when they fuck me.
Re: Why do some people have problems comprehending email? (r - WRXtranceformed - 07-21-2011
I absolutely hate email. It's completely inpersonal, just like texts meaning can be misconstrued. People can be "email tough guys" and get upset and all worked up instead of just picking up the phone and calling to discuss it like a human being. Our office had a $650k client try to threaten us with contract cancellation through email because they felt one of our clients (their competitors) was illegitimate. Seriously?
In my opinion, good business relationships both internally and externally are formed through speaking with someone on the phone and through in-person meetings. I don't trust anyone who says they are "too busy" for a phone conversation or a 15 minute coffee break meeting because I know these are the same people that sit there for 2-3 hours a day and craft clever emails to internal and external people. Don't get me started on internal emails...I delete half of the spammed stuff that comes through our corporate email chain.
I talked with one of our executive level sales managers and he basically refuses to communicate through email. I agreed with him 100%.
Re: Why do some people have problems comprehending email? (r - WRXtranceformed - 07-21-2011
And to your point, I have now learned to avoid long emails because I know people won't read them. I craft a lot of C-level emails and a good rule of thumb is if you can't see all or most of the email when you pull it up on your smartphone, the other person isn't going to read it at all.
Try bulleting out points and condensing the emails, even with long / complex thoughts. you might have better results.
Re: Why do some people have problems comprehending email? (r - JustinG - 07-21-2011
i agree 100% Lee, in your particular role. Being in Sales/Acct Management an email just doesnt cut it.
When I was in sales I rarely used email to communicate with my clients/accts, just because I was able to express a sense of caring over the phone which is almost impossible through email. Most I used email for then was to occasionally confirm an appointment, or if the contact requested email communication.
Re: Why do some people have problems comprehending email? (r - WRXtranceformed - 07-21-2011
I feel like we're turning into a Wall-E society, with a bunch of secretaries and managers sitting behind a keyboard typing with their fat fingers instead of stretching their legs and getting out to know the people they are doing business with.
Re: Why do some people have problems comprehending email? (r - G.Irish - 07-21-2011
Here a couple of email issues at work I've encountered
Email Overload
Too many people sending too many emails to people they don't apply to. There'll be people that hit Reply All instead of Reply for a lot of things, and other people who habitually send things to distribution lists that don't make sense. What this does, is cause people to either start ignoring emails or start creating email rules to filter emails. Filtering emails sometimes leads to important emails getting filtered when they shouldn't have been.
On the subject of email overload, the situation I hate the most is when people Reply All with a useless one-liner. "Good idea!" "I like this!" "Thanks!" "Awesome!"
Having to dig through an email chain to get to the point
Something that consistently leads to wasted time and confusion is when someone forwards an email chain that might have 5 or more replies in it, but then doesn't write why they're forwarding it to you, what is relevant in the conversation, and what action you need to take. This just wastes people's time and increasing the likelihood of a fuck up. If you forward something to me, at least give a brief summary.
Email is not a Documentation System
If there is a document that everyone needs like a requirements document or an standard operating procedures document, all of that information needs to be put into the pertinent document. I've been in places where a manager or someone else emails requirements around then thinks that it is now "documented". So what happens when a new person comes on? Now they've gotta somehow get every single email on the subject and try to reconstruct what the requirements should be or what the procedure should be.
Email is great if you need to go back and pinpoint when who said what but that doesn't mean it should be used in lieu of properly written documentation.
There's plenty of other email fouls I can think of, I may write more later.
Re: Why do some people have problems comprehending email? (r - G.Irish - 07-21-2011
If it Needs an Immediate Response, PICK UP THE PHONE
I don't think it's too much to ask to respond to emails promptly, but if something is important and needs to be answered right now, pick up the phone and call. At my job this is especially important because my development machine is on a separate network from the one I usually get email on. If I'm coding I may or may not see that email right away.
At the very least, if you need a response to an email by a certain time, say so in the email. "I need an answer by 1 pm today"
Re: Why do some people have problems comprehending email? (r - BLINGMW - 07-21-2011
WRXtranceformed Wrote:I talked with one of our executive level sales managers and he basically refuses to communicate through email. I agreed with him 100%.
That's interesting. I assume he'll call someone if they email him though, right? Certainly he doesn't just ignore it. And as far as ignoring "corporate spam", well ok, that's fine if they do that and it's really not relevant to you.
We may have to agree to disagree, or maybe our work environments or subjects are just too different, but limiting it to what can be viewed on a smart phone just won't cut it. You're right that keeping them short is something to work on. It's certainly something I've had to work on, especially with managers who have short attention spans. I mean hell, look at my posts here, I'm terrible! :lol: But I read and write valid emails every day that would be at least a half page if you printed them, and I don't consider that a "bad" thing. The result of a few of those emails might end up being something that should be documented properly, but as the thoughts are fleshed out, email seems like a good way to go.
I don't mean to sound like email is THE way to communicate-- I think we can all agree that face time, the phone, meetings, texts all have their place for different types of information. And any of those forms can be misused too. That's another topic though equally important, determining which is the correct way to go.
Good points too G, I agree with all. I think some people DO check their emails every 5 minutes thanks to smart phones, forget that others don't, and to their detriment consider it a valid "emergency" form of communication.
Re: Why do some people have problems comprehending email? (r - Mike - 07-21-2011
because they're too busy reading message boards.
Re: Why do some people have problems comprehending email? (r - Ken - 07-21-2011
I think it depends on your position, as mentioned before in sales it just doesn't cut it to e-mail.
Also agree on the uncessary copying or reply-alls, it's insanely annoying to have your inbox filled up with babble that doesn't apply to you.
I think a good rule of thumb is if you've reached 6 exchanges on the same topic, pick up the phone, it'll probably be easier.
Re: Why do some people have problems comprehending email? (r - BLINGMW - 07-22-2011
ok well that settles it then, thanks for listening. I'll continue to assume a lack of grasping basic email concepts when the work environment requires its use as a sign of gross, widespread, incurable incompetence.
If I had an employee that was
Apoc Wrote:inconsiderate, selfish and generally pretty stupid.I would fire them.
Re: Why do some people have problems comprehending email? (r - Apoc - 07-22-2011
BLINGMW Wrote:If I had an employee that was
Apoc Wrote:inconsiderate, selfish and generally pretty stupid.I would fire them.
Hopefully you don't need more than a few employees.
Re: Why do some people have problems comprehending email? (r - HAULN-SS - 07-28-2011
i kinda want to add to the list of incompetencies using email.
My company had a demo a while back with some people from Nvidia. They want to push what they are selling to some of our customers. We want to be a part of that, since we are the ones doing the development on Nvidias hardware. The in-person demo went well. Ever since then it has been the fucking definition of "herding cats" with the nvidia guy trying to get people to attend this demo he is trying to set up, that the people WANT to also attend. This started on June 24th, and the Nvidia guy has proposed at least 6 dates. More than once, the email replies have come back
"Can't make that date."
"Out of town for 1.5 weeks"
"This date is no good for me"
That is the entire email. This leaves everyone on this distro of about 6 people wondering what, in fact, are the good dates for this meeting? The nvidia guy, being a salesperson at heart, has so far resisted the urge to tell everyone to fuck off. He just keeps rescheduling meeting times, and the people who want to be going to these meetings I guess hope that he eventually strikes gold with their oh-so-conflicted schedules. Moral of the story - one line emails are not necessary. If you can't at least add some value to the email thread, don't reply. Not one of the fucks on this email chain have suggested times that they are available, and so far the meeting has been pushed back from june 24th to august 18th.
Re: Why do some people have problems comprehending email? (r - Apoc - 07-28-2011
Sounds like they don't actually want to attend the meeting. :dunno:
Re: Why do some people have problems comprehending email? (r - HAULN-SS - 07-28-2011
I would agree, except they are the ones who requested this meeting with the nvidia guys take place. Why go out of your way to ask for something you dont want? I dunno..I gave up, and just always click accept as if im going to be there, even if I end up not being able to make it
Re: Why do some people have problems comprehending email? (r - Jake - 07-28-2011
Do you guys have a common calendar where you can see free/busy time? We use Outlook/Exchange here, so I can see when everyone I want to invite is free or not. Makes things easy.
Re: Why do some people have problems comprehending email? (r - Ryan T - 07-28-2011
I don't mind email for correspondence between co-workers or service providers, but I rarely use it for clients. Of course my field of work is vastly different from what the majority of you guys do. I'll use email/facebook message as an absolute last resort if I can't find somebody and they won't answer their phone, but more often than not I'll just go to their house.
One thing that does irk me regarding emails comes from my supervisor. Her office is literally right beside mine. I can talk a little louder than normal level and tell her something without getting out of my seat. She will email me one line emails at least 4 or 5 times a day. "Please remember to change this contact" "Dont' forget that our meeting is at 3pm" etc. It's bound to take her longer to pull up her email and send that message than it is for her to just walk 8 steps and tell me.